Yes HD Channels Using PC Card

[joni2000]

Hello HB13DISH !

I'm totally new in this forum. This is my first message.

I'm french... so sorry for my poor english. I will try to be as clear as possible in my communication.

I'm living in Israel and a good friend of me need help. Perhaps you can help us.

He is receiving TV with the HD Yes Package. Tov...

He want to connect directly his dish to a computer to have the best quality of image in his TV (full HD) and to record programs with a simple clic of mouse.

His computer is very strong and recent. I think that he only needs to add in his PC a Tuner Satellite card + CAM Module to receive his HD Yes Package on his PC.

The questions are : what kind of Tuner Satellite card + CAM Module is compatible with the HD Yes Package ? With which software ? To choose the right CAM, what is the "encryption system" used by Yes ? Viaccess ? Mediaguard ?

Thanks a lot for your help !

Joseph.

[HB13DISH]

Hello HB13DISH !

I'm totally new in this forum. This is my first message.

I'm french... so sorry for my poor english. I will try to be as clear as possible in my communication.

I'm living in Israel and a good friend of me need help. Perhaps you can help us.

He is receiving TV with the HD Yes Package. Tov...

He want to connect directly his dish to a computer to have the best quality of image in his TV (full HD) and to record programs with a simple clic of mouse.

His computer is very strong and recent. I think that he only needs to add in his PC a Tuner Satellite card + CAM Module to receive his HD Yes Package on his PC.

The questions are : what kind of Tuner Satellite card + CAM Module is compatible with the HD Yes Package ? With which software ? To choose the right CAM, what is the "encryption system" used by Yes ? Viaccess ? Mediaguard ?

Thanks a lot for your help !

Joseph.

Hello Joseph and welcome to the forum.
I will move this post to a new thread, as it is about Yes HD.
Yes uses NDS (Videoguard) encryption system and their receives are dedicated for Yes package with a card reader and the software (in Hebrew and I think also in English).
"His" dish as you call it, is probably a shared community dish, unless he has a private house and Yes has indeed installed the dish only for him.
Either case he would need to have another dish and point it to Amos 4W, otherwise the subscription might get interrupted.
I think that it would be very difficult to find a HD DVB-S2 card that has a CAM for NDS and to open the YES package, especially the HD channels, as the card has to be inserted in the dedicated receiver (married to it, so to speak).
If the main problem is to record HD, then he should ask if Yes has already a HD PVR receiver, as this is the next step that they should go in my opinion.
My recommendation is to wait in the meantime.
Hope that this helps.

[joni2000]

Thanks HB13DISH for your answer.

To help my friend seems to be not so simple.....

He is living in private house so Yes has installed a dish only for him.

I found in another forum (videohelp) that "Dragon" CAM Module is compatible with NDS (Videoguard) encryption system.

Do you have any information or experience about this CAM ? Is it HD ?

Am I the first in Israel to try to use Amos 4W signal through a computer ?

Thank you !

Joseph.

[HB13DISH]

Thanks HB13DISH for your answer.

To help my friend seems to be not so simple.....

He is living in private house so Yes has installed a dish only for him.

I found in another forum (videohelp) that "Dragon" CAM Module is compatible with NDS (Videoguard) encryption system.

Do you have any information or experience about this CAM ? Is it HD ?

Am I the first in Israel to try to use Amos 4W signal through a computer ?

Thank you !

Joseph.

Hello again Joseph,

Dragon CAM is an old type and is not suitable for HD.
I am sure that you are not the only one who is trying this, but your friend's biggest mistake was to sign up a 3 year contract with Yes for the HD, instead of trying other possibilities first.
If he is French, then he might have been able to get a subscription to Canal Sat (France) which has several HD channels. Would mean a large dish, but in a private home he can do what he wants within reason.
Anyway, you can try to post a new thread in the Astra 28.2 ( Sky UK) section and ask if anybody in the UK manages to watch Sky HD (also encrypted in NDS) using a PC and a special CAM.
How many points did Yes put in his house?
He will need another LNB and coaxial cable going to his PC, if he wants to experiment.
He will also need a good DVB-S2 PC card and CAM option so that he would put the special CAM in it and then the Yes smartcard.
The PC has to be powerful enough for HD and the HDD will eat up a lot of size for the HD recordings. Minimum 500 GB.

[joni2000]

Hello again HB13DISH,

my friend is not French (nobody is perfect...) so he is not interested to get Canal Sat at home.

You said that Dragon CAM is not suitable for HD. I'm very new in this domain, but if I understrand well, to receive an HD signal, you only need an HD TUNER. From my understanding, the function of the CAM is only to give a digital key to the tuner to have a clear (not encrypted) signal. In other words, and tell me if I'm wrong, there is no "HD-CAM" only "HD-Tuner".

So, at the end of the day, the only problem that I have to help my friend is to find the good CAM Module for YES... I found in France a very nice Tuner Satellite DVB S2 Digital Everywhere for 170 euros. It seem to be an acceptable price.

I will look later in the Astra 28.2 threads if there is a solution with the NDS encryption system.

Thanks a lot for your help, Joseph.

[HB13DISH]

Hello again HB13DISH,

my friend is not French (nobody is perfect...) so he is not interested to get Canal Sat at home.

You said that Dragon CAM is not suitable for HD. I'm very new in this domain, but if I understrand well, to receive an HD signal, you only need an HD TUNER. From my understanding, the function of the CAM is only to give a digital key to the tuner to have a clear (not encrypted) signal. In other words, and tell me if I'm wrong, there is no "HD-CAM" only "HD-Tuner".

So, at the end of the day, the only problem that I have to help my friend is to find the good CAM Module for YES... I found in France a very nice Tuner Satellite DVB S2 Digital Everywhere for 170 euros. It seem to be an acceptable price.

I will look later in the Astra 28.2 threads if there is a solution with the NDS encryption system.

Thanks a lot for your help, Joseph.

The CAM has to be HD compatible.
This means a special software or firmware has to be installed in order to support the encryption of HD channels.
The card looks good, and they have a list of providers that can work with it.
The Sky UK and Sky Italia seem to work with it. (They are both NDS)
The recommended CAMs are
Dragon*, T-Rex* (S2 required)
*Some Cams require specific Firmware to work correctly
Between Dragon and T-Rex, I think that I would go for the T-Rex
You might need a programmer, just in case.
Don't forget to order also some of the options (Remote, etc.)
There might be an issue with how to keep the activation live if the Yes smartcard is out of the receiver for a long time.
Recommend to look for other cards, while you are at it.

[charly20]

Dragon and T-Rex are the same.

[HB13DISH]

Dragon and T-Rex are the same.

Yes, that is correct for version 4.1
I was thinking of the newer CAM T-Rex SuperModule version 4.6

[charly20]

well then it's the same than the T-Rex, only that it has a Anaconda-type sim smartcard built-in, where the 2nd slot is in the original T-Rex (yes, you can put 2 smartcards: one full size and one in sim format). This is going to be useless at the end of October, as Premiere is switching off Nagra 2.

[joni2000]

Waooo, if I understand well, it seems to be possible to help my friend !

Because I'm very new in this domain (but less than yesterday...), could you please tell me precisely which model of CAM I need ? Dragon S2 ? or T-Rex Supermodule V4.6 ?

And at last, where is it possible to buy it ? (in Israel or abroad by Internet).

Thank you a lot HB13DISH and CHARLY20 for your precious help.

Regards, Joseph

[charly20]

well i used to have both the Dragon and the T-Rex modules. They worked fine with NDS cards from UK: that's my experience.

However, I have not tried them with HD channels, but I don't see a reason they should not work.

Also, keep in mind you need a programmer and a loader card.

[HB13DISH]

Waooo, if I understand well, it seems to be possible to help my friend !

Because I'm very new in this domain (but less than yesterday...), could you please tell me precisely which model of CAM I need ? Dragon S2 ? or T-Rex Supermodule V4.6 ?

And at last, where is it possible to buy it ? (in Israel or abroad by Internet).

Thank you a lot HB13DISH and CHARLY20 for your precious help.

Regards, Joseph

The card mentions Dragon / T-Rex, so my guess is that they mean version 4.1 (the S2 refers to the card model, not the CAM)
But I would consider the latest model, just in case it has some improvements over version 4.1
The decision is entirely in your hands.
As for where to buy it, I doubt if you would find this card in Israel so your best bet is from abroad, but ask about the shipment method and cost before you order it, as most shops prefer to send it by courier like UPS or DHL which cost a lot more than by post and they would charge you for customs release.
Also ask about insurance, as I got several packages stolen in the past.
You will then have the hassle of releasing it from customs, for anything over $50.

[joni2000]

well i used to have both the Dragon and the T-Rex modules. They worked fine with NDS cards from UK: that's my experience.

However, I have not tried them with HD channels, but I don't see a reason they should not work.

Also, keep in mind you need a programmer and a loader card.

I need a programmer and a loader card ? Ooops... Is it not "plug and play" ? (Sorry if this question is stupid.)

We have an official YES Smartcard. I suppose that I have to program the T-Rex CAM to support the YES Smartcard. Is that right ?

Could you please tell me more about this operation ?

[HB13DISH]

I need a programmer and a loader card ? Ooops... Is it not "plug and play" ? (Sorry if this question is stupid.)

We have an official YES Smartcard. I suppose that I have to program the T-Rex CAM to support the YES Smartcard. Is that right ?

Could you please tell me more about this operation ?

Dedicated CAMS like Viaccess, Irdeto, Seca are plug and play type.
There are other CAMS like Dragon / T-Rex which are used for experimental purposes like opening encrypted channels or emulating various CAMs
I haven't used this CAM, so I am not sure if the default settings will have NDS emulation, but you will need the programmer and a loader card as without it you will not be able to change the firmware especially to something that supports HD.
I shouldn't worry too much about this, just get the whole kit as Charly suggested.
Warning:There is an adult channel 9 months subscription included, but your friend will need a dish pointing to Hot Bird 13E to watch it.

[HB13DISH]

Hello Joseph,
Just in case you missed this possibility
_http://www.technisat.com/index4986.html?nav=PC_products,en,76-215
and the CI option for the CAM
_http://www.technisat.com/indexf40a.html?nav=PC_products,en,76-219
Technisat is a well known manufacturer, and has a lot of support.
You will need two PCI slots.
You can download the user guide.

[charly20]

The Dragon and the T-Rex are basically pirate CAMS. That's why they are sold without software.

You have to get the software from the Internet.

Then load the software on the Loader card with the help of a programmer.

Then insert loader card in CAM to load software into the CAM.

Then it works.

Please note that I have not tested it with a YES card; there is no garantee it will work; but chances are high.

Programmer: Ebay item #300265428523 will do.

[joni2000]

Hello Joseph,
Just in case you missed this possibility
_http://www.technisat.com/index4986.html?nav=PC_products,en,76-215
and the CI option for the CAM
_http://www.technisat.com/indexf40a.html?nav=PC_products,en,76-219
Technisat is a well known manufacturer, and has a lot of support.
You will need two PCI slots.
You can download the user guide.

Hello my friend,

I stop to say "thank you" at every post but you really help me a lot in this jungle... This domain is (still) totaly new for me.

Those equipment seem to be very good for our needs but I found another very interesting equipment. Look at this :

_http://www.digital-everywhere.com/en/alcms/index.php?sid=1187859689

and it seems to work very well with Dragon and T-Rex :

_http://www.digital-everywhere.com/en/alcms/index.php?sid=1193593142

Israel is not in the listed countries but Dragon and T-Rex are listed in the required CAM.

From my opinion, the + of Digital Everywher product is that equipment is not using 2 PCI slot but only 1 or even 0 (it is connected to the PC through a simple Firewire connexion) and it include the slot for the CAM Module.

Do you have any experience or feedback with this product ?

Joseph.

[joni2000]

The Dragon and the T-Rex are basically pirate CAMS. That's why they are sold without software.

You have to get the software from the Internet.

Then load the software on the Loader card with the help of a programmer.

Then insert loader card in CAM to load software into the CAM.

Then it works.

Please note that I have not tested it with a YES card; there is no garantee it will work; but chances are high.

Programmer: Ebay item #300265428523 will do.

Hello Charly,

now it's more clear for me.

My friend have to buy :

-1- A HD Tuner Satellite for PC "S2" like Technisat Skystar HD2 or Digital Everywhere S2.
-2- Dragon or T-Rex CAM (last version)
-3- Loader Card to program the CAM to make it run with the NDS Encryption.
-4- A programmer (like the SmartMouse programmer) to load the software into the Loader Card.

And I have also to find the sofware in the net.

Glooops.

I never do it in the past but I hope that it's not too hard...

I will keep you informed.

BR, Joseph.

[HB13DISH]

Hello my friend,

I stop to say "thank you" at every post but you really help me a lot in this jungle... This domain is (still) totaly new for me.

Those equipment seem to be very good for our needs but I found another very interesting equipment. Look at this :

_http://www.digital-everywhere.com/en/alcms/index.php?sid=1187859689

and it seems to work very well with Dragon and T-Rex :

_http://www.digital-everywhere.com/en/alcms/index.php?sid=1193593142

Israel is not in the listed countries but Dragon and T-Rex are listed in the required CAM.

From my opinion, the + of Digital Everywher product is that equipment is not using 2 PCI slot but only 1 or even 0 (it is connected to the PC through a simple Firewire connexion) and it include the slot for the CAM Module.

Do you have any experience or feedback with this product ?

Joseph.

Hello Joseph,
I am glad to help, as this thread is quite interesting and you are probably going to help others in Israel to find a way to record Yes HD channels.
And yes, you can stop pressing the Thank You button, otherwise I am going to blush.
Actually I saw this website and I thought you were referring to it when you first mentioned the name of the company. (see my previous post before #6)
The assembly guide is included here. see attachment.
BTW: Where is your friend located?

[joni2000]

Hello HB13DISH,

My friend and I are living at Ra'anana. And you ?

Joseph.

[charly20]

Hello Charly,

now it's more clear for me.

My friend have to buy :

-1- A HD Tuner Satellite for PC "S2" like Technisat Skystar HD2 or Digital Everywhere S2.
-2- Dragon or T-Rex CAM (last version)
-3- Loader Card to program the CAM to make it run with the NDS Encryption.
-4- A programmer (like the SmartMouse programmer) to load the software into the Loader Card.

And I have also to find the sofware in the net.

Glooops.

I never do it in the past but I hope that it's not too hard...

I will keep you informed.

BR, Joseph.

Joseph:

you are correct; it's a bit intimidating at first but you'll manage.

One point though: does the PCI have a CAM slot? Also, Technisat products have poor compability with many CAMs. Be careful.

Good luck anyhow.

[joni2000]

Hello Charly,

I will do my best to succeed...

I will also check carefully the compatibility between the Tuner and the CAM.

I will keep in touch.

Regards, Joseph.

[charly20]

you can reach me at e-mail removed

[joni2000]

Ooops Charly, your email has been removed...

Is it possible to send a Private Message through this forum ?

Joseph.

[HB13DISH]

Ooops Charly, your email has been removed...

Is it possible to send a Private Message through this forum ?

Joseph.

Sorry for the removal, but we have to follow the forum rules.
You need to post few more posts before your PM is activated and also it will take few more weeks.
As this forum is based on the exchange of information for the benefits of all members, then please ask all your questions in the open forum.