BeeB FTA

j.m.

Why was the encryption removed?

& more to the point "Who" made this Stirling decision?

dishdoctor

Because why should the bbc pay sky to encrypt and then supply decryption cards free..............

j.m.

Perhaps because they have allready recieved payment for the creation of TV services via the licence fee

As the Beeb does quite well out of selling its programs abroad, one might be tempted to think it might protect its (our) products with a little more vigor.

We'll not bother going down the road of discovering why BSB was sold off

Perhaps terminating DBS transmission completely may save a few quid all the way round

rolfw

The BBC might have a million potential viewers outside the UK, by potential I mean those that either have a dish pointing at 28.2 or a dish capable of movement onto the same.

Most of these will not watch it non-stop, possibly only for a few hours a week, so the view of all of these Johnny Foreigners leeching our "quality" programming, is perhaps a little misplaced. I can see their (The BBC's) reasoning, because if it works, it will save them millions of pounds and this can perhaps be spent on programming.

I know that there a lot of very disgruntled ex-patriate Brits who can no longer receive the BBC channels since they moved satellite and became free to view, but I wonder whether the outside UK viewing numbers have increased or decreased, my money would be on the decrease, as most people prefer to watch channels in their first language.

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custard

Guys, get over this Free To View stuff. The BBC (God bless it!) is the only org. strong enough to take on the Borg that is SKY. Soon, ITV, C4 (eventually, little C5) will see the light. I live in ROI (NI originally) and pay for BBC via Irish Sky, also having to pay Irish TV licence for RTE rubbish (with adverts!). I also have a UK box for real tv (RTE is so very poor).
I am delighted that I am at least paying some money indirectly to the BBC. If there was any justice in the EU we would be free to buy whatever TV we wished. Instead, in ROI, we cannot get ITV, C4 or C5 (although I am lucky enough to get these by paying for UK subscription).
The BBC was the first institution to breath freedom into the Eastern block via radio- why should TV be any different in the 21st Century?
My point is that, given the choice, I would pay for traditional UK TV without the nonsense of 3-400 muppet channels that accompany the 8 or 10 I watch.
As another contributor wrote, the Arabic and Indian etc. channels are viewable for an additional fee, so why not UK channels throughout Europe without the profit-making suppliers of UK Sky cards we see on the 'net?
This nonsense excuse of copyright is indefensible in a pay per channel environment. the programme-makers get their cut!
-BBC forever!

Channel Hopper

Dont you mean increase ?

Anyhow the only things stopping them from continuing to view are

1) Get a much larger dish installed (more work for the professionals )
2) Move into an area that can receive the signal

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denis1501

Dear Custard,
You do not pay an Irish TV licence to watch what you call 'RTE rubbish', you pay a license fee because it is the law in Ireland that if you have a TV, you must have a TV license. Furthermore I would like to know just what you think is 'rubbish' and 'very poor' about our national station which I find to be quite a rubbish comment if I may say so.
I also don't understand how you claim to be 'paying for BBC via Irish Sky' when the BBC channels are available without subscription and free-to air on the Astra 2D satellite.
You later claim to have a UK sub (for real tv!) as well for ITV, Channel 4 and 5 so you're asking me to believe you have the irish sub in one room and the UK sub in another at the same address! Just to give the beeb a few quid!
One last question, what's your definition of 'real tv'?
best regards
D.

philip24

I have the same set-up. Irish and UK FTV on the same box. Use your imagination.

rolfw

No CH. I mean Decrease, I have the feeling that those that wanted British/BBC channels were already tuned the 28.2E prior to the changeover and had probably bought their digibox and acquired a viewing card long before it. But since the change I wouldn't be surprised if more people lost it than gained it.

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PoloMint

custard,

Did you know ‘little C5’ was in fact the first national UK terrestrial channel to broadcast on satellite, long before the BBC.

It broadcast in analogue from 19.2 throughout the late 90’s, soft scrambled in videocrypt. This encryption meant that anyone with a truly FTA only analogue receiver could not decrypt it, but anyone with a videocrypt enabled receiver could watch it without a card. The idea being that videocrypt receivers would only be sold in the UK and so would prevent people in Europe watching channel 5 (as they didn’t have the rights to broadcast there). This might seem off topic but this rather clumsy and unsuccessful attempt at limiting channel 5 reception in europe shows that they are committed to encryption, they did everything they could, apart from issuing free cards, to keep channel 5 in the UK long before the BBC ever made it to satellite. Channel 5 signed a 5 year renewal of their encryption contract with Sky last year (at level of prices the BBC refused to pay) so unless they change their contract it will stay scrambled for quite some time.

I don’t mean to attack you, but I don’t see the BBC in the same pioneering light as you do, they saved £85 million by not signing with Sky, something which is often overlooked, but I am glad they did save the money, that £85million can go towards better programmes etc etc.

As for it being legal to watch BBC and Ch4 etc in other countries, well it already is legal to watch BBC abroad if you are lucky enough to be in the footprint. (Anything broadcast FTA in eurpoe can be watched legally, freely, in any country, regardless of weather the broadcaster has permission from the copyright holder to broadcast in that country). As for ITV, channel 4 and 5 following it isn’t a case of simply European law changing, these channels (and the BBC) don't buy the copyright rights to broadcast to Europe, only to the UK, if they were forced to allow their programmes to watchable in all member states then they may be forced to pay more to the copyright holders of the programmes they show, so the end result could be the BBC saving £85m in encryption and spending it on increased copyright costs.

As for the number of people receiving BBC I agree with Rolfw, I expect it has gone down, it was never hard to get a digibox and FTV card, even people with no direct connection to the UK and with no UK address could get them easily. But getting bigger dishes and having to subscribe to Sky or try and get a FTV card when they are/were available is more complicated and much more expensive.

denis1501

Philip,
I believe he states:
"I am lucky enough to get these by paying for UK subscription".
The key word being "subscription" not that he has a FTV card.Meaning that he does indeed have two subscriptions to Sky.
regards
D.

philip24

O.K.

So he uses a UK address and a ROI address, and never the twain shall meet.

I don't see much of a problem, I can't see Sky turning the money down, although they wouldn't know in this case, depending on how they've done it.

custard

Dear all,

Glad to see that there is some contention regarding RTE viewing.

Hi Denis1501,
Thanks for your comments.
Just to explain "rubbish", I mean wall to wall US programmes available on all other channels. I mean extended advertising breaks; I mean the lack of any breakfast programming from the "national" monopoly. I mean the Dublin perspective on everything (as opposed to outside the Pale). Absolutely no digital satellite interaction on RTE channels (apart from ye olde worlde teletext-type offering). I place RTE in the same bracket as the dreadful Eircom telecommunications monopoly; outdated and defensive as it sells itself as "Irish" as some sort of excuse for being second rate. The reason I am so scathing is because I genuinely believe that RTE have the capability to be so much better. It is important to have a national broadcaster that accounts for content on its channels and gives value for money. An hysterical defence of RTE is no substitution for good quality programming and modern digital news interaction (a la BBC).
"Real" TV is a mixture (in my opinion) of BBC, ITV, C4, C5. TV3 is trying to bring ITV programmes (Ant & Dec etc.) to a wider audience.....entertaining and well done for trying against the state monopoly. Also a breakfast programme on TV3...not terribly well funded, but funded nonetheless and gathering viewers. TV tend to be like music; a personal taste thing- apologies as I don't appreciate RTE's efforts because they are too "cosy" funded as they are.
Yes, I pay for 2 subscriptions as suggested previously. Free to air on ROI Sky for BBC removes the digital interaction available on the UK version- so please compare apples with apples. Yes, I have FTA on the ROI card- of course! The BBC channels (1 and 2 only) appear well down the ROI EPG (recently moved again) and someone is paying for that appearance in the list......I thought subscribers did but perhaps I am incorrect.
The reality of the licence fee in ROI is that it pays for RTE TV and radio. Additional advertising subsidises this. Do you think the puerile Pat Kenny is worth ?600,000 a year (bargain, covering TV and radio) of our money? Rubbish personified.

I'm sorry if I froth about the BBC so much- but they have stayed right at the top by investing in technology to give value to the public. I absolutely love BBC Breakfast Time; brilliant mix of serious news and personality (Bill Turnbull, Carol on weather, Natasha etc. and Declan on the economy). Recently a live OB from Galway on the Irish economy- great stuff BBC. Weather from the Glenshane Pass in the middle of a blizzard- poor Carol!
No sign of RTE West of the Shannon- for shame!

Dear Polomint- yes, you make some very good points about C5. I agree the BBC saved money going FTA and commend them for it.

Best Wishes to all and hopes for open skies so all our requirements are met!