Newb motorised setup woes!

hacksawbob

Scuse the long post but I'm trying to get this straight in my head.
setup: relook 400s cryptik HH motorsied, 1M Orbital dish, experience: nil!
Right heres the story, Got it all set up, first problem, holding the spirit level against the pole inotice there is some movement of the level against the pole, ie the pole is'nt straight? anyway not to be detered I mount the motor, and the dish and check the motor bracket for level just forward of the the angle where it fits to the pole, I've get this bang on horizontal and vert, isn't that a better test than measuring the pole anyway?

So I put the signal detector in line between motor and receiver start having a mess with the relook just to get an idea of the menus etc, find the diseq1.2 menus and start having a play with the motor, as the dish is moving I can hear the sat sigs coming and going . All good. So I set the dish to due South to start searching in earnest, sadly the coax flylead that is connecting the sig detector pulls out and it drops, balls! Anyway, retreived uncracked, but this is where my problems start. when I plug it back in it just beeps at me every second or so. So I reset the box and all seems fine till I try to move the motor then the detector starts beeping again, I notice the motor is making a sound with each beep too. So I decide that actually between motor and LNB is a better place for the sig detector, so its moved, but now no satellites are being detected at all, even on a full scan West to East. Also tried without the sig detector and just using the reciever level and quality meter I cant see anything turning up. Ive checked true south on google Earth, there is a church tower about 5 miles away which I'm sighting on.
For my position I'm using 53.5N and 2.5W
a few Q's
1 the Cryptik mount is usals capable, do I set the dish to true south and then just enter the lat long and the sat and let the dish point to where it thinks it should be and then I fine tune?
2. If I'm using usals do I need to use diseq 1.2 aswell?



3. I have set the cryptik mount to 53.5 but the sat dish bracket has its own scale for elevation what do I set this to? I thought zero as elevation has already been set on the motor, but it wont go down below about 10 degrees. on www.satsig.com the calculator says I need a dish elevation of 28.75. is this what I need to set on the black dish mount scale?

Ive checked cables for continuity with a meter. Motor is working fine could the LNB have gone 'bad'? I have the receiver set up to 1 LNB (2 are possible) and to loop through as per the instructions with the coax connector rond the back
thanks for any help.

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Rob

If the pole is not 100% vertical on two sides you are wasting your time.
You might as well throw everything away and go down the pub.

Get the pole 100% straight !

Oily

Well,throw it my way then go down the boozer

try getting hold of a inclinometer,much more accurate than a spirit level

rolfw

OK, ignoring the fact that your mast possibly isn't plumb, here's what to do.

Go into the receiver motor setup menu, set your coordinates and send the motor to Thor 1W.

Go out to the dish, check that the rotary scale on the motor is just slightly East of zero, then if your dish is pointing roughly South, move the whole assembly on the mast and the dish elevation only to see if you can find Thor. The dish face will be a little higher than vertical, there should be instructions on how to calculate the declination (angle of the dish bracket) in the motor manual, but there is no substitute for actually locking on to your due South satellite.

Rolf If you enjoy our site, you can help support it by wearing our unique branded merchandise, you can do this by clicking on my baseball cap, making a direct donation with Paypal by clicking on the Donation button below, or using our site supporting advertisers, to do this, click on the central image below. Follow us on Twitter, click on the twitter image.

hacksawbob

Thanks for the quick replys guys,
"If the pole is not 100% vertical on two sides" I suspect the pole may be wider at the top than it is at the bottom! if I check the right side spirit level says move bottom to the right, on the left it says move the bottom to the left! in a metre long pole I'd say there is a 1-2 milimetre discrepency, If I bring the pole to vert on one side the other will be out. (front edge is vetical.) I guess I'll chuck the pole and try another.

"should be instructions on how to calculate the declination" I cant find any thing in the motor mount about setting this, does 29 degs sound right? is this "on top" of the 53.5 degrees lattitude setting on the motor?

rolfw

The setting on the motor body is the elevation setting, the one on the dish is called the declination and totally separate, there is normally a calculation in the handbook of the motor for working it out, but if not, then just find Thor in the manner I've described above and you will be spot on.

Rolf If you enjoy our site, you can help support it by wearing our unique branded merchandise, you can do this by clicking on my baseball cap, making a direct donation with Paypal by clicking on the Donation button below, or using our site supporting advertisers, to do this, click on the central image below. Follow us on Twitter, click on the twitter image.

Ronaldo

I was a newbie like you and have the same setup, I had similar problems when I installed mine. In the end I removed the motor and fastened the dish straight to the pole to see if it was vertical. I found Hotbird using a compass and the meters on the receiver. It work fine, so I knew the pole was OK. I also knew where the dish needed to be pointing, angle/inclination etc. when the motor was re-installed.

Sir Bronking

welcome ronaldo (your first post)....but

when ligning fixed dish up, the pole does not have to be truelly vertical, (take A S's world famous tyre mounts)
so you cannot check pole is vertical with just the dish.
unless you say set it at 13e for hot bird then slide it round for 12.5 w to see what reception you get

patience is not a virtue, its a godsend.a picture is worth a thousand words
polite notice: do not hijack threads,do not double post,
search and ye shall find (before you ask)

hacksawbob

Been through the manual and cant find anything relating to the declination setting. it only mentions the elevation from your geographical position. I've had a play with the mount, the pole I found had been crushed as I had over tightened the U bolts. I have slid it down a few inches now so I am on 'virgin' pole and have re-aligned as good as I can. I am finding different readings from different spirit levels so I'm not sure what to trust. Any way I can see that I need to discover this declination. I have my dish facing due south now. What you seem to be saying rolfw, is send motor to thor. If I do that with USALS because I enter my lat and long doesn't the receiver make the correction for me (+ 2.5 degs west?) therefore I keep the motor facing due south and let the software take care of the corrections. Or do I need to guess the 2.5 degs and manually move the mount that much. I think I need to be correct with declination before I search east/west if I am trying to search for declination AND East West to get Thor I'll be there all night (again)

Rob

There are "sticky threads" at the start of this section by longstockings, T24, and bronking showing you how to set by your dish, and motorised settings.
Have a long look before you attempt anything, it's well worth it.

hoppo

Hacksaw,

Your motor "looks" the same as mine. Mine is branded illusion but unfortunately, 1, i am in valencia & 2, i threw the instructions away.

Put the motor on pole, facing due south at the angle it says (elevation). This has to be pretty acurate. Tighten it up. Attach the dish and find Hotbird at 13E. Easy to find and not too far off south. When fixing the dish put the LNB level (no skew) the motor does the skew. When you've got it tighten the dish to the motors pole.
Now try to find Astra @19.2E & 28.2E. If you have them your on the right road. After try 8W & 30W (hispasat). If you have them you've really cracked it , job done.

I am going to ask my mate if he still has his booklet (should do, i told him to keep it ) I'll email you it if i find it on line.

Hoppo

mickeymegabyte

"I am finding different readings from different spirit levels so I'm not sure what to trust. "

hello!!

If you can't trust a Spirit level use a PLUMBOB..........tie a nut to a piece of string .......hold next to pole and eye it up until parallel.(phew that took some spelling).

Hope this helps.

hacksawbob

I've had a read through the stickies but I cant find the answers I'm sure they are there I just cant see them. Hoppo I have had several trips to the Fallas to play in an Irish band in vallencia at St Patricks Day (17th March) (have you heard of a band called Wash?) Anyway I have the manual but I cant find any declination info in it, maybe you have some in yours. Also I cant find a cryptik website Sorry I must be incredibly thick, I know the receiver is working And I have checked the cabling. Does anyone know what the declination should be PLEASE? is there anyway I can work it out. From the stickiies the dish front should be 'just' pointing up from horizontal I'll give it a go...

hoppo

My motor is set at 39 deg, i am in Valencia of course. Dish set at 20deg (85cm). If you set them both lower (i think) by 3-5deg and try for hotbird again (south and left a bit) see what you get. Can't find anything online for you.

Hoppo

rolfw

We're getting tied up with the declination figure, when it is not essential to know it, do as I suggested above and the setup will work. If you find it difficult to find 1W using the readout on a portable TV, then buy yourself a small sat meter from Ebay or perhaps your local Maplin.

Rolf If you enjoy our site, you can help support it by wearing our unique branded merchandise, you can do this by clicking on my baseball cap, making a direct donation with Paypal by clicking on the Donation button below, or using our site supporting advertisers, to do this, click on the central image below. Follow us on Twitter, click on the twitter image.

Sir Bronking

your location i take it is somewhere around wigan/leigh is that right

patience is not a virtue, its a godsend.a picture is worth a thousand words
polite notice: do not hijack threads,do not double post,
search and ye shall find (before you ask)

hacksawbob

hi thanks rolf, I have an analogue sat finder, I checked the pole with a pumbob (on the inside of the pole) and its dead on. I have set the attenuator to just below full gain, set the declination to 25 degs as the shop guy said, I checked the face of the dish with a spirit level and it is ten degrees off vertical up. Sited the dish due south after taking a reading from google earth and siting off a church tower on the same longnitude. set the lnb setting to thor then put the tp freq to eleven point three two five (number keys not working on this laptop ) gone to usals menu sent dish to thor, looking at the (azimuth?)scale on the motor the dish has moved towards the east by like one degree, I thought it would move the dish west to get one deg west, but anyway. The manual for the motor says now move the dish with motor to correct for longnitude, so I have done this by two point five degs east making a total of about three point five degs to the right of the zero mark (as viewed from behind the dish) and moved the dish up and down listening for the sat finder to squeal, nothing, and no reading from the receiver L OR Q meters, where am I going wrong?

hacksawbob

arrrgh lost a post there somewhere, yes I am in Horwich near the reebock stadium. I have set up a tv and receiver so I can see it from the dish. I have set the lnb to thor and tp freq to eleven three two five (keyboard numbers not working well on this laptop ) when I go into the usals section and set my lat and long then send the dish to goto. The dish moves anti clock (from above) to the east by one degree, should n't that be one deg to the west? anyway the motor manual says to correct for longnitude by 2.5 extra so that would be three point five in total anti clock from the zero, Then play with up down left right til I get a signal on the receiver. Am I right?

hacksawbob

Hi, Ok I have tried the setting the motor to 0 then manually moving the whole mount clockwise (west) to find thor still nothing, could this LNB be duff? I have double checked the mount and the cabling and I took the receiver to the shop and checked to see it could get a signal OK I even removed the sat finder in case it was the problem. Clutching at straws now, I have a fair degree of patience for most things but I'm starting to lose it after three weekends, tommorrows weather doesn't look to hot either.

Sir Bronking

just give us 5mins

patience is not a virtue, its a godsend.a picture is worth a thousand words
polite notice: do not hijack threads,do not double post,
search and ye shall find (before you ask)

Sir Bronking

look at this piccy while i do a bit of typing (got to rush city on soon)

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patience is not a virtue, its a godsend.a picture is worth a thousand words
polite notice: do not hijack threads,do not double post,
search and ye shall find (before you ask)

Sir Bronking

first set bracket to what it say's in manual ie latitude/elevation then using spirit level and bevel gauge tilt dish as shown in piccy. if dish won't go there because of bracket adjust elevation bracket to suit and give your self a bit of play/adjustment. then set motor to 0deg's, and look for thor (slow sweeps,if you don't get it first time (but i think you'll be close) do another sweep slightly adjusting dish angle (very slightly) once youve got it post back
good luck

patience is not a virtue, its a godsend.a picture is worth a thousand words
polite notice: do not hijack threads,do not double post,
search and ye shall find (before you ask)

rolfw

Please don't get hung up on degree settings on the dish, it is just wasting time.

If your longitude is 2.5 degrees West, then the dish would move 1.2 degees East to find Thor at 1 degree West (as you are further West than it). When you have asked the receiver to do that, do not touch the motor movement controls again, but go outside and by slowly moving the whole assembly on the pole and the dish elevation only, try and find 1W.

Rolf If you enjoy our site, you can help support it by wearing our unique branded merchandise, you can do this by clicking on my baseball cap, making a direct donation with Paypal by clicking on the Donation button below, or using our site supporting advertisers, to do this, click on the central image below. Follow us on Twitter, click on the twitter image.

hacksawbob

Thanks Rolfw tried that, Still nothing!!! tried a few slow sweeps from side to side at each dish degree setting. I even tried removing the motor out of the loop and going straight from receiver to LNB, NADA. Just out of curiosity it took the voltage from the outer of the F connector to the mounting pole, tested at 80 volts, does that sound OK? sounds a lot for an external voltage.

Yeshi

i had this problem with mine,... I ended up lowering the dish slightly (not the motor) // then thor fell in.. and its been a cuty ever since