If you thought the last thread on motoring offences was bad....

[Channel Hopper]

The proceeds of Crime Bill has been extended, without prior consultation. Even plod thinks it's a bad idea.


_http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/law/article6892830.ece

So local councils, civilian investigators, and I suppose their third party businesses dealing with collections will be able to use the Proceeds of Crime Bill to take possessions without fear of legal repercussion.

The public no longer have a voice.

[Analoguesat]

And this bit is expecially nasty:

.....asset seizure will result in financial rewards: “Investigation bodies will receive a share of money recovered as additional funding to incentivise further work in recovering the proceeds of crime.”

We know exactly where that will lead dont we

[Tivù]

Strange thing trying to sell Democracy as the only way when we don't even have it ourselves.

Local Authorities are already under fire for overzealous snooping whilst claiming to exercise powers under another of our wonderful anti-freedom Acts.

[Topper]

It would seem far too many of these councillors have been spending too much time on all expenses paid trips to Italy asking the Mafiosa how it is done

It really is scandalous, you can be fined for putting the wrong recycling item in the wrong bin and now this, well the Lord Chief Justice Mr Jack Straw should be ashamed of himself for letting this happen.

[2cvbloke]

I read about this the other day and I'm absolutely disgusted by it!!! Is this the 1700s? No!!! This is the 21st century and such barbaric practices should not need to be put in place!!!

If they want to recover money from fines or tax arrears, go through the courts and assign a debt recovery agency to the task, not just break in and take what you like!!!

I have a feeling this could be the straw that breaks the camels back, a lot of people will be up in arms about it...

Revolution, anyone?

[Vipersan]

There won't be enough room in the prison system if this rotten-to-the-core govt keep pushing the way they currently are ..
There will come a breaking point where joe public simply won't stand any more and will refuse to toe the line..
Not that I would advocate such things ...but I vividly remember riots on the streets...bloody picket lines during the miners strikes...and pensioners prepared to do time rather than pay thatchers govt a penny with their insane alternative to council tax.
There is only so much the average law abiding citizen can take....and I'm constantly amazed that those out-of-touch pill0cks in their ivory towers keep testing that limit ..time an time again.

VS

[Channel Hopper]

Originally Posted by Vipersan and pensioners prepared to do time rather than pay thatchers govt a penny with their insane alternative to council tax. There is only so much the average law abiding citizen can take....and I'm constantly amazed that those out-of-touch pill0cks in their ivory towers keep testing that limit ..time an time again.

It was a sane alternative to the rates system, which was completely out of date.
The Council Tax system is less fair overall when you take into account payments by a householder against, for example a family of seven, but the planning stage given during the times of discontent means the council legal eagles have got the system water-tight. If you don't pay, you go straight to jail (and it seems from next week they can now take your property to recover the costs without question)

[Vipersan]

Originally Posted by Channel Hopper It was a sane alternative to the rates system, which was completely out of date. The Council Tax system is less fair overall when you take into account payments by a householder against, for example a family of seven, but the planning stage given during the times of discontent means the council legal eagles have got the system water-tight. If you don't pay, you go straight to jail (and it seems from next week they can now take your property to recover the costs without question)

...I agree to a point ..that properly implemented ' it would have been fairer ..
For a family of 7 wage earning adults ...
it should have been Rates divided by 7 ...
..not as they tried to push it out..
7 x the rates ....(which is what they would have liked..

I have no great love for the council 'machine' myself ..
I was recently informed my shop rates (charged seperately on a 5 mtre x 5 mtre floorspace) ajoining living accomodation ...will next year go up by 50% ...
I am not earning any more ...in fact my turnover is less ...but still they want their pound of flesh ..
I don't see any improvements for my money ...and was informed 'quietly' by a friend who works for the council ..
That ..its just another revenue generating exercise ..recoup losses made by local govt when the Icelandic banks collased ...and to to fill the 'black -hole' in civil service pension pots ..
I can't even afford a pension ...yet I pay for theirs...

Sorry if I sound a bit grumpy ...but I believe I have good reason..

and fwiw ...I just see these new motoring related edicts in the same light ...
Stealth Tax ....
The Sheriff of Notts has nothing on these guys..

rgds
VS

[Topper]

I agree with you all....

I think the contents of this thread could make the next series of grumpy old men

I am considering converting my front room into a prayer room and provided I have a meeting once per month with 20+ people I will not have to pay council tax anymore!!!!

Yes that is how to avoid it, round here at least!

[Vipersan]

Originally Posted by Topper I agree with you all.... I think the contents of this thread could make the next series of grumpy old men I am considering converting my front room into a prayer room and provided I have a meeting once per month with 20+ people I will not have to pay council tax anymore!!!! Yes that is how to avoid it, round here at least!

Put my name down ...I'll come and pray with you


..oh ..and perhaps I should mention ..
I'm officially registered as 'Jedi Knight' on the last census ..

[Channel Hopper]

Next up.

_http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/lawandorder/6534319/State-to-spy-on-every-phone-call-email-and-web-search.html

[Tivù]

Thanks CH!

I'm seriously thinking of moving to a Country which doesn't claim to be Democratic (As long as I can get Astra 2D ........)

[compufunk]

From the perspective of an outsider looking in, whats happening in the UK at the minute is frightening. There seems to be so much over regulation and legislation. Its a little like some elements of East Germany before the wall came down.

The worst thing about what your Home Office is proposing is that its really not going to help that much in combating terrorism. If a terrorist just uses an anonymizing network like Tor, they'll make it very hard to track their usage.

_http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tor_%28anonymity_network%29

I'm sure they have advisers who have informed them of this, so what's the real agenda? Snooping on what Joe public is doing most likely.

Originally Posted by Tivù Thanks CH! I'm seriously thinking of moving to a Country which doesn't claim to be Democratic (As long as I can get Astra 2D ........)

2D is coming in loud and clear over here Tivu. Its just as wet as the North Yorks Moors, so you'll feel right at home

[Topper]

Originally Posted by compufunk Snooping on what Joe public is doing most likely.

Interesting comments cf, I have been concerned for a while now that my email was being monitored since I do not get some of it until 12 hours later, I was beginning to think it was BT but now suspect the BB indeed I recently sent an email from my normal account suggesting this to a hidden account suggesting that they were not very good at it either, and this practice was supposedly only reserved for criminals and that even then they needed home office permission, lo and behold that email never arrived to my other account at all, yet I have proof of it being sent, just to check I sent another tonight and that did come straight through....makes you think

[compufunk]

Hello Topper,
I remember rumours of something similar to what you are talking about earlier in this decade. It was post 9/11 and some (anonymous) people were suggesting that mail was being vetted. If you sent two mails at the same time (roughly), one of them containing key words like 'President' + 'kill' and one that didn't. The mail containing the key words would be delivered a considerable time later than the mail that didn't.

To be honest, I didn't believe it at the time. Now that you have mentioned it. I might see if I can get any more info on it.

BTW, the thought police are on the way with a better weapon than George Orwell had ever conceived ......
_http://www.itpro.co.uk/617020/scientists-use-brain-scans-to-read-minds

I hope the current trend in the UK has passed before that technology matures.

[Topper]

Originally Posted by compufunk BTW, the thought police are on the way with a better weapon than George Orwell had ever conceived ...... _http://www.itpro.co.uk/617020/scientists-use-brain-scans-to-read-minds I hope the current trend in the UK has passed before that technology matures.

Yes that is quite daunting I have to say. I know re-reading my post makes me sound a bit paranoid however I think with good reason, the first Email is now 3 days late so I suspect it has disappeared into the ether. I certainly know that the ISP's are forced to keep a copy of everything that passes through their mail systems for future reference by a.n.other a task which must be quite complex and require vast amounts of storage space