Petition- tracking device to replace road tax

**mhku** · 29-01-2007

Dear all,

Have done this, it's very easy. We have nothing to lose by trying - if you don't want Tony & Gordon to have all our money because we drive a car or bike, then please at least sign up THIS IS REAL AND IT IS A PROPER GOVERNMENT SITE.

The government's proposal to introduce road pricing will mean you having to purchase a tracking device for your car and paying a monthly bill to use it. The tracking device will cost about £200 and in a recent study by the BBC, the lowest monthly bill was £28 for a rural florist and £194 for a delivery driver. A non working Mum who used the car to take the kids to school paid £86 in one month.

On top of this massive increase in tax, you will be tracked. Somebody will know where you are at all times. They will also know how fast you have been going, so even if you accidentally creep over a speed limit* you can expect and additional fine with your monthly bill. If you care about our freedoms and stopping the constant bashing of the car driver, please sign the petition on No 10's new website

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/traveltax/

Please pass this on to anyone who owns a car/motorcycle. It affects them.

* Its not limited to speeding.

They also know where parking restrictions etc are located. And you! (Additional - I have just been on the No10 site and there is LESS than 500k signed up to it. There are over 30million vehicles and drivers in this country. Just to register 3% of those against this proposal there needs to be 900k signed up! and the closing date is 20/02/07. Did you know about this?

**rolfw** · 29-01-2007

Put my name on the petition, whether it will have any affect though, who knows?

**BGonaSTICK** · 29-01-2007

Did mine a while back

Don't let the scum get away with it

***2cvbloke*** · 30-01-2007

I prefer the idea of PAYG driving, as in, you buy fuel (Petrol, Diesel, Ethanol, Bio-Diesel, LPG, and soon Hydrogen, whatever your car drinks), and drive. Simple...

But then again, the government aren't there to make our lives easier, are they?

**BGonaSTICK** · 30-01-2007

I agree. The simplest ideas are nearly always the best, but oh no. Not this bunch of losers...

***2cvbloke*** · 30-01-2007

Originally Posted by BGonaSTICK

I agree. The simplest ideas are nearly always the best, but oh no. Not this bunch of losers...

Rebel!!! REBEL!!!!

**Salty25** · 30-01-2007

Why don't the government go on the attack at car manufactuers and oil companies - the government should be enforcing the manufacture of ethanol capatible engines, so that by 2010 all new cars are able to run on 100% enthanol and significant numbers of older vechiles have been converted, and the fuel stations should all be converting to enthanol. And, of course, there should be continued and greater research into different fuels.

The real worry is the environment.

**rolfw** · 30-01-2007

There are downsides to the ethanol argument, but we need to be moving in several new directions to solve this problem, including of course electic cars.

**Salty25** · 30-01-2007

Totally agree, I think though you need some sort of standard to help fuel stations - but then again they cope with petrol AND diesel, so I'm sure they could cope with multiple fuels. Haven't they been doing loads of research in Iceland, using hydrogen and other things?

**BGonaSTICK** · 30-01-2007

I've never understood the electric car argument, unless you produce the electricity by some method other than fossil fuels

We've got to do something fairly radical though, or we're not going to make it through the next century.

I think we should drill a hole into the core of the Earth and install a massive heat pump where Croydon currently is.

I suppose that if we all decided to leave the car at home and walk everywhere, this government would introduce a leather tax (again).

Mind you, a return to the 1790's would give us a few extra years to live.

***2cvbloke*** · 30-01-2007

Originally Posted by Salty25

Totally agree, I think though you need some sort of standard to help fuel stations - but then again they cope with petrol AND diesel, so I'm sure they could cope with multiple fuels.

Well, in the old days, as I'm sure most here know, there was the starring system (according to my dad it went from 2-Star to 5-Star, with 4-Star being the longest survivor), so there were a few pumps for the different fuels for different vehicles, so, we know how to have different fuels at different pumps on the forcourt, so why don't we go back to this idea with modern fuels? Looking at local stations, all the pumps are mostly Unleaded, with a few being Diesel, and maybe the odd bio-fuel, but that's rare round here, so some of the unleaded pumps could be replaced with the bio-fuels so it's all equal...

***Marts*** · 31-01-2007

Signed the petition .. I wonder .. how will this affect car hire companies

Anyways, I run my car on pure Biodiesel .. good chappie I iz

**Topper** · 31-01-2007

Originally Posted by Marts

Anyways, I run my car on pure Biodiesel .. good chappie I iz

Funny I don't remember seeing a chip shop on Gozo

satbunny · 01-02-2007

I actually support road pricing as a replacement for road tax and fuel duty. it will shift the burden of tax to discourage excessive car driving in the peak times, stop the stupid school run Mums. It will also reduce the tax burden on those living in rural areas where there will be no charges, but still reduced road tax and fuel duty.

What I want to see is a privacy barrier, which was proposed in the Dutch schemes, so that an independent body handles the sat tracking and charging, and hands the money to the Govt. but then destoys the data about where you were. This is the important thing to campaign on.

We are the most monitored and watched nation in the world, now that is something to rebel about, not a sensible shift of taxes.

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/yes2roadpricing/

***BarMoo*** · 02-02-2007

Well, you can tell which members live in the UK - and have sucked-up the political agenda/pseudo nonsense.

So, everybody's green now (this month). I read today that 'Kids are on the green march'. Hello, I did that collecting tonnes of paper crap when I was 9. ..... Whatever.

I was horrified to hear that if you nipped round your local chip-shop to collect waste oil (sadly not beef dripping in most parts) - (to make bio diesel) - you would still have to pay tax

[and that you would have to dye it turquoise so that the police could easily pull you up a chip-shop perp if you hadn't declared].

If the Govt. wants money - why don't they just yank-up the VAT to 19% - like Germany did in January (from 16%). My WHOLE life just got 3% more expensive, LOL.

And I don't drive.

.

**Topper** · 02-02-2007

Originally Posted by BarMoo

I was horrified to hear that if you nipped round your local chip-shop to collect waste oil (sadly not beef dripping in most parts) - (to make bio diesel) - you would still have to pay tax

Surely any self respecting government is going to make sure they get a cut whatever way you carve the joint, indeed I am surprised they didn't latch onto it 30 years ago when a woman was paid £500,000 (a lot of money then) by an oil company for not revealing the secret formula which is generally just lotions and potions from under your kitchen sink (stronger versions) and cooking oil be it sunflower or rape seed.

**rolfw** · 18-02-2007

Thr PM has made a brief reply to the 1.5m signatures, this is an extract:

Originally Posted by T Blair

Over the next few days, I will be sending out a response to everyone who has signed the petition against road charging, explaining the problems the country faces and why I believe road charging is surely part of the answer here as it is in many other countries.

I'm not kidding myself that this will change people's views overnight. I am convinced, however, that the focus on this issue that the e-petition has brought about will help improve our understanding of the problems and the realisation that there are no cost-free answers. And that surely has got to be good news for the health of our democracy and for the chances of our country coming up with the right and sustainable solutions to the long-term challenges we face.

Which roughly translated means that you the public who have signed the petition, obviously don't fully understand the problem and need to be educated until you do and then the government will introduce the legislation.

**the_happy_traveller** · 18-02-2007

My problem with road charging is the probable way it will be done.
Are we going to hve road charging but no road tax and cheaper petrol or is it just going to be another cost for the motorist to bear?

Whilst I agree we have to do something, it has to be one way or the other.
If we have to pay to use the roads, it should only be once, not multiple times.

**rolfw** · 18-02-2007

I don't disagree with paying for my driving, but of the amount we all pay, only a small amount is spent on the roads and transportation system, it is just a general tax. What will happen is that the vast majority of drivers will pay more and whether we drive or not, the added costs get passed down the line onto the goods we buy and services we use.

What I would really like to know is the estimated cost of this tracking system, including the hidden bits and how foolproof it is going to be, also who will eventually have access to or be sold the information/data collected.

**Stephen W** · 19-02-2007

This will be the Labour party's equivalent of the Poll Tax and will lead to the same result - a General Election defeat.

***Yeshi*** · 19-02-2007

Originally Posted by Topper

Funny I don't remember seeing a chip shop on Gozo

Last time i went to gozo there was nothing there apart from pumkins and a few churches... but then again it was a while ago.. infact grey pre war buses run everyone everywhere :|

Anyway im going to sign... im sick of this goverment stealing all our money to give to other people who blow themselves up.. whilst in the mean time making us poor..

edit .. i sign up to **** speed cameras off aswell.. pointless camera's they are... everyone knows where they are and just slow down anyway..

**mhku** · 19-02-2007

The Govt. are trying to control road usage by making us pay. If I remember correctly, this is controlling money supply which is a Tory tactic (Milton vs. Keynes)?

If they really "cared" they wouldn't use a penalty based model, they would improve public transport. While there is no viable alternative people will use their car until it is economically unfeasible e.g. it costs you more money to get to/ from work than you earn.

Using buses where I live is more complicated than joining the Masons. Bus stops have no route maps and no timetables. Bus-stops in the US have digital displays telling you how long until the next bus. I've used buses in countries where I don't speak the language; buses here are a mystery, expensive, small and stink.

Two years ago I worked in Bromsgrove. I caught a train and then a bus. After a few months they changed the bus timetable: the 5.15 bus from the bus station arrived at the train station 5 minutes after the train had left. Genius. I went back to using my car.

excessive car driving in the peak times

What is excessive? If most people work 9-5 what are they supposed to do? Sit in the car park until non-peak time?

**Low Profile** · 19-02-2007

There are too many cars on the road (hence the congestion), so the question is how to reduce this amount. Encouraging people to use public transport, park and ride schemes, vehicle sharing and only making journeys that are absolutely necessary is the answer (if necessary by pricing). It's far too easy to jump in your car and sit in a traffic jam these days without considering the implications. An alternative would be to ban all cars from city centers and have out of town car parks. I would also support banning lorries from the road during peak hours, especially Monday morning and friday afternoons.

**Topper** · 19-02-2007