Satellite system help, (on the cheap)!

jonboyuk · 19-12-2007

Hi everyone,

I am a complete n00bie and this is my first post, so do bear with me! As with many other people, I have left Sky and am left over with a dish, cables etc. For basic telly viewing I just use DVB-T, that keeps my other half happy. However, I would like to look further afield into using my old Sky dish.

What can I do with what I have? I appricate that I will need a DVB-S card for my laptop and I won't get much with a mini-dish. But I'll love to start dabbling, just out of curiosity if anything!!

I do have some slight restrictions however. I live in a shared house in a conservation area. My current dish is at ground level on a pole and it works just fine. However that's all the neighbours will allow me to have, so I'm a bit stuck with the old mini-dish, (unless there's something else I can stick on without them noticing?) I'm sure they'd notice a whopping metre dish!

So the bottom line is, will I be able to get a single sausage with my set up or am I doomed from the word go unless I can upgrade my dish?

Thanks for everything! (Phew)

Jon

**Topper** · 19-12-2007

to the forum jonboyuk

Whilst it is true the sky dish is slightly limiting size wise, it will not stop you getting the strong birds like 13 East and 19 East, but what will stop you is the sky stb. Practically useless for any other bird. Oh do not misunderstand me you will get some stuff but very very limited as they are deliberately programmed not to allow it to find stuff on other sats.

Get a cheap set top box from one of our sponsors on the forum, swing your dish West and away you go.

jonboyuk · 19-12-2007

Thanks for such a quick reply. Instead of buying a separate box, can I use a DVB-S card for my PC?

**rolfw** · 19-12-2007

Yes you can.

I think Topper missed that bit in your first post, probably doing several things at the same time.

Make sure you get a DVB-S unit which is compatible with the independent viewers like ProgDVB, as otherwise it will be an uphill struggle.

The Sky minidish should be OK for Astra 19.2 and Hotbird 13 East, both of which should be relatively easy to locate.

**Robbo** · 19-12-2007

Hi jonboyuk,

I only recently tore down my motorised minidish, but I could get more than just 13E,19E and 28E on it.
I definitely could get 42E and 23.5E, and I'm sure there were a few others I could get a signal on as well (some transponders).
I did used to suffer the occasion picture break up or even total loss if it rained really hard though.

You might be able to get away with having a zone 2 minish instead, they are the same shape, but about 20cm bigger. Also you can get the transparent dishes up to 85cm, I would have thought they might be more unobtrusive.

Robbo

**HB13DISH** · 19-12-2007

Hello jonboyuk,

What are the advantages to you of using a DVB-S PC card in the laptop over a standalone STB?
Did you review the PC cards that would be suitable to you and which models?
Please give a list of the models and their prices.
You might like to consider the Dreambox 500S which has all kind of nice features and especially a cardreader slot to enable watching a legitimate smartcard, without buying an additional CI CAM.
You can then use it to watch TV on the TV set and also on the laptop.
DVB-S PC cards with CI CAM are not that cheap, that is if you would be thinking at some stage to buy a subscription to a service, only to discover that there is no slot for it.

**HB13DISH** · 19-12-2007

Hello again,

You can put a bigger dish INSIDE one of the rooms with a glass window facing south and no obstacles, if you have one.
The signal will be attenuated depending on several factors. A test would give you an indication if this possible.
Then just run a cable to a diseq switch.

I am sure that the neighbours will not have a say in this matter, but the missus might object.

**Topper** · 19-12-2007

Hello jonboyuk

Yes Rolf is correct I did 'miss' the words, sorry if I confused you, I have to confess as the title said on the cheap I ignored the DVB-s bit as they are not very cheap

jonboyuk · 20-12-2007

Hello everyone,

Thanks for such a wonderful bunch of replies. Honestly I've never used such a helpful forum.

HB13DISH: I would like to use my pc for PVR functionality. Missus won't like the dish inside!!

Topper: Can you advise on any DVB-S units in light of what you said (compatibilty with ProgDVB etc)?

Robbo: Thanks for that. Given that this is 'on the cheap' and I won't be having anything motorised, how easy is it to spin the dish around and pick up another sat? Is it worth buying a satellite finder from Ebay

for £1.99 or is that a con?

Thanks

Jon

**Robbo** · 20-12-2007

Hi again,

Yes you can swivel the dish around manually, and it is not too difficult with a minidish.

When going between satellites both the azimith and elevation need to be changed.

If switching between 2 satellites like 13E and 19E or 19E and 28E you would probably get away with setting the elevation to half way between the two, and then just swing the dish round between them.

I certainly would get a satellite finder meter, it makes the job of aligning the dish a little easier or you can get away with using the meter on the receiver.

Motorising isn't an expensive option at all. A basic motor like the Moteck sg2100 is about £40. You may be ale to pick a cheaper make up for even less. It certainly saves messing about with the dish every 5 minutes.

Robbo

jonboyuk · 31-12-2007

Thanks guys!

I have taken the plunge and bought a TechnoTrend: S2-3650 CI. Does anyone know of this? Will it do the job okay? Got it from DVBShop.net! I do confess that I'm somwhat nervous that it may not do the job. Someone please put my mind at rest!!

Thanks again

jonboyuk · 02-01-2008

Sorry, one other thing. As the S2-3650 comes with a cam interface...what else do I need? For example, if I want to pop my Sky Card into it, what CI would I need?

Are there any posts on here explaining what cams/cards etc are?

Jon

**Topper** · 02-01-2008

I understand the only cams that will do the job are the Dragon / T rex cams.
There are plenty of threads about how to do it in the Dragon cam section

Click here

**Robbo** · 02-01-2008

Originally Posted by jonboyuk

Are there any posts on here explaining what cams/cards etc are?

There are many different types of CAM, some like the Diablo and Dragon etc are multicrypt and can be loaded with different firmwares via a programmer, to enable them to decrypt a variety of diferent encryptions. There are also dedicated CAMS for specific encryption types like Irdeto, Nagravision, Viaccess etc. You can't buy Sky UK (VIdeoguard) CAMS at the moment, but with the correct files the Diablo and Dragon CAMs can read Sky cards for the time being (probably until the next card swap), but a Sky box is still needed to keep the card alive once in a while.

jonboyuk · 02-01-2008

If I buy a T-rex 4.1 does it mean I have to buy another one each year? Sorry, it's all so confusing!

**Robbo** · 02-01-2008

Originally Posted by jonboyuk

If I buy a T-rex 4.1 does it mean I have to buy another one each year? Sorry, it's all so confusing!

No, It means that IF or WHEN (rumours??) Sky do a card change, the Trex and Diablo probably won't work anymore for Sky, until and IF the 'teams' come up with a way of getting it working again via a new file, it may or may not be possible.

jonboyuk · 02-01-2008

Oh I see!! I just read somewhere that certain things only last for 6 months or a 12 months. That must be the card that you buy to put in the CAM, no?

**Robbo** · 02-01-2008

It depends on the card. Some cards like DigitAlb are valid for 12 months, some are valid for 3 or 6, it just depends on what you pay for and what is offered. Sky subscription cards last as long as you keep paying (get new one if card changes, automatically). Sky Freesatfrom Sky cards last until they change the cards, but if it is with 2 (it might be 3) years of purchase they will send another.

jonboyuk · 03-01-2008

I see!! I just spent the last hour reading duwgati.com. It's going in...finally! Ultimately, the purpose of all this is so that I can dabble with HD! I have a 42" plasma and I need more pixels! Annoyingly, after investigating Lyngsat it would seem the Americans are blessed with ten times the amount that we get. It seems no dish can pick up America either. Pooh!

Anyway, to my question. Robbo - your suggested motorized unit seems like a good idea now. Only thing is....it seems to control the azimuth and the elevation, however what about LNB skew? I gather it doesn't do this? Does it make a huge difference?

Thanks

**Robbo** · 03-01-2008

Originally Posted by jonboyuk

Anyway, to my question. Robbo - your suggested motorized unit seems like a good idea now. Only thing is....it seems to control the azimuth and the elevation, however what about LNB skew? I gather it doesn't do this? Does it make a huge difference?

Thanks

A conventional motorised dish only rotates on one axis, however that axis is aligned to the Earths polar axis, which is why it works. As the motor rotates, from our point of view it is changing both elevation and azimuth at the same time. Anyway as it swings round, the whole dish gets skewed, so it is not necessary to have a separate skew adjustment.

vma · 03-01-2008

If you want to use your LAPTOP, I would recommend a SkyStar2 USB box. This is basically the same as the SkyStar2 PCI version from TechniSat.

However these are not indicated to be used with a rotor, as they don't output enough power. There are plugin's to provide DiSEqC-1.2 compatibility, but chances are that the build-in tuner of the SkyStar2 will break fast.

Dishes behind a window do work (again, see my site to believe it), but only if the window is of a simple type, i.e. only one glass and without any kind of filters.

Cheers,
vma

jonboyuk · 03-01-2008

Thanks VMA. Actually I have commited myself to a TechnoTrend: S2-3650 CI! Is this going to work okay?

Robbo, I understand. Very clever indeed. The one you suggested - is it easy to install and does it work with a Sky Minidish? Also, does it require any extra cabling? It's a bugger running further cables into my house, that's all!

jonboyuk · 03-01-2008

VMA your site doesn't work!!

vma · 04-01-2008

Hmmm...

Geocities is not nice, when it comes to their ads, but they do have a great reliability. Just checked and it works:

http://www.geocities.com/dazed1970

The picture I was referring to is here:
http://www.geocities.com/dazed1970/crazy/dazed1970.htm

Regarding the TechnoTrend S2-3650 CI, I have to confess that I did not try that one out, yet. It should work fine with the included software, but I have no clue, if it works with ProgDVB.

I own two SkyStar2 and did test a SkyStar2 USB in the past and id behaved exactly as the PCI release - I did get two blue screens with it, but I was testing it heavily.

Cheers,
vma

jonboyuk · 05-01-2008

Thanks VMA, that set up has sooo many cables :P How do you power the motorised dish?

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Satellite system help, (on the cheap)! Discussion on systems using a DVB satellite receiver card SD or DH in a pc.

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