DTT Started in Israel

**HB13DISH** · 03-08-2009

After a long wait, DTT transmission started in Israel on the 2nd of August 2009 (yesterday),
There are five FTA channels
IBA Channel 1
Channel 10
Channel 22
Channel 33
Keneset (Israeli Paliament)

A modem from KONKA KSDT980 is offered for sale by major outlets, cost is a one time 400 NIS (~60 Pounds).
The transmission can be received on UHF Ch. 27 in northern part of the country, UHF Ch. 26 in the center, Eilat and Beer-Shiva UHF Ch. 29
As many households, especially pensioners have been spending over 200 NIS a month on a basic package in order to receive these channels (and others), I am hoping that many would take this opportunity and disconnect from Yes Israel in order to save a lot of money.

If the satellite provider Yes Israel has any sense, they should retaliate by offering existing subscribers who wish to disconnect, a mini package which has a receiver, smart card that includes these national channels for free or at a very modest cost like 20 NIS/month, but has the option of adding other encrypted channels and/or VOD, something that the DTT can't offer and will not offer for a very long time.

It would be interesting to see how DTT is going to be adapted in Israel.
My guess is that there will not be a huge demand over the next six months because the channels are not that exciting (except for channel 10 which might be closed down in few weeks time due to their major losses), and a possible new offers by Yes Israel.

***Turok*** · 03-08-2009

Hello!
sounds very intresting,for what is dtt meaning?
i never heard this?
looks like the use dvb t only in europe!
what is the resultion of the picture,same then on dvb S?
is the signal strong enough,also with small antennas,if i rember,when i was in irael 14 years ago,the have real huge Tv Antennas on the roof,maybe the are no longer needed,when analouge television swtiched of complitly!

**PaulR** · 03-08-2009

DTT = Digital Terrestrial Television

Now known as Freeview inthe UK, it is another name for DVB-T.

ronbarak · 07-09-2009

Hi,
I am configuring now my new BlazeVideo Digital TV-Stick DVB-T with BlazeDTV software, and the scanning did not find any channels.
I am in Israel.
Do you know where can I find the frequencies for the Israeli channels ?
Thanks,
Ron.

**HB13DISH** · 07-09-2009

Originally Posted by ronbarak

Hi,
I am configuring now my new BlazeVideo Digital TV-Stick DVB-T with BlazeDTV software, and the scanning did not find any channels.
I am in Israel.
Do you know where can I find the frequencies for the Israeli channels ?
Thanks,
Ron.

Hi Ron,
The frequencies are shown in the first post, but here they are again
The transmission can be received on UHF Ch. 27 in northern part of the country, UHF Ch. 26 in the center, Eilat and Beer-Shiva UHF Ch. 29
So if you are in Tel Aviv, then try scanning UHF Ch. 26
I am interested to know if you get a good signal and the quality of the picture.
I am surrounded by high rise buildings which can make my reception impossible. This is why I haven't tried it yet.

ronbarak · 07-09-2009

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

Hi Ron,
The frequencies are shown in the first post, but here they are again
The transmission can be received on UHF Ch. 27 in northern part of the country, UHF Ch. 26 in the center, Eilat and Beer-Shiva UHF Ch. 29
So if you are in Tel Aviv, then try scanning UHF Ch. 26
I am interested to know if you get a good signal and the quality of the picture.
I am surrounded by high rise buildings which can make my reception impossible. This is why I haven't tried it yet.

Hi HB13DISH,
How do I translate channel numbers to MHz/KHz ?
The setting of the USB TV-Stick DVB-T calls for setting the KHz values.
For instance, where can I find what's the KHz value for UHF Ch. 27 ?
Thanks,
Ron.

**HB13DISH** · 07-09-2009

Originally Posted by ronbarak

Hi HB13DISH,
How do I translate channel numbers to MHz/KHz ?
The setting of the USB TV-Stick DVB-T calls for setting the KHz values.
For instance, where can I find what's the KHz value for UHF Ch. 27 ?
Thanks,
Ron.

The center frequency for UHF 27 in PAL-I is 522 MHz (Video 519.25 and audio 525.25)
PAL-I is used in the UK. We use PAL is Israel. But try this to start with until I find a better table.

ronbarak · 07-09-2009

Thanks, I'll try it.
Bye,
Ron.

**HB13DISH** · 07-09-2009

Originally Posted by ronbarak

Thanks, I'll try it.
Bye,
Ron.

Does the gadget comes with an antenna or you are hoping that you will not need it?
I would suggest to enhance the reception with a simple UHF antenna, otherwise you might not get a strong enough signal to activate the receiver.
Did you get a good analog signal in the past from inside your apartment or home?

**HB13DISH** · 07-09-2009

Here is a good reference
_http://www.dipolnet.com/tv_channels_pal_bg-dk__bib02.htm

ronbarak · 07-09-2009

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

Does the gadget comes with an antenna or you are hoping that you will not need it?

It comes with a small antenna that attaches to the USB stick with an earphone like connector.

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

I would suggest to enhance the reception with a simple UHF antenna, otherwise you might not get a strong enough signal to activate the receiver.

Wont work, because of the connector I mentioned above.

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

Did you get a good analog signal in the past from inside your apartment or home?

I received a decent reception at my bedroom. Am testing now at a different location.
In any case, I wanted the frequency to avoid the lengthy scanning phase (it is lengthy!).
Bye,
Ron.
_http://www1.dealextreme.com/productimages/sku_8468_1.jpg

ModerationPlease upload images as attachments rather than using IMG

***Turok*** · 07-09-2009

picture quality of dvb t is not so good then on satellites!
swiss tv srg plan to start hd dvb t,i can receive there signal 30 km away from there boarder,with a big antenna,but to receive the new standart,i have to buy a new receiver,old one will be not compatible!
my sister lives near germany maybe 27 km away, in past before dvb t coming picture was very bad with indoor antenna,now i can receive 27 dvb t channels from germany austria and switzerland together!
for only 5 channels,that people can receive here,when the live far away from the boarder,i would never buy dvb t!

ronbarak · 07-09-2009

Originally Posted by Turok

picture quality of dvb t is not so good then on satellites!
swiss tv srg plan to start hd dvb t,i can receive there signal 30 km away from there boarder,with a big antenna,but to receive the new standart,i have to buy a new receiver,old one will be not compatible!
my sister lives near germany maybe 27 km away, in past before dvb t coming picture was very bad with indoor antenna,now i can receive 27 dvb t channels from germany austria and switzerland together!
for only 5 channels,that people can receive here,when the live far away from the boarder,i would never buy dvb t!

That's interesting. I bought the DVB-T USB stick, so I could watch TV on my laptop. What would you suggest as a better alternative ?

Bye,
Ron.

**HB13DISH** · 07-09-2009

Originally Posted by ronbarak

That's interesting. I bought the DVB-T USB stick, so I could watch TV on my laptop. What would you suggest as a better alternative ?

Bye,
Ron.

Satellite TV with hundreds of TV and radio channels.
You can use a USB receiver to connect to your laptop.
Problem is, you will not get many channels in Hebrew, only from Amos satellite which have the same five DTT TV channels.
In fact, you can also receive the same DTT channels if you put a dish for Amos and another one for Hot Bird 13E.
See my profile on the left.

ronbarak · 07-09-2009

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

Satellite TV with hundreds of TV and radio channels.

I'm not a big TV consumer (actually, my TV broke a year ago and I never got around to fix it :-)
That's why I thought the DVB-T USB would be nice, in case I do want to watch the odd programme.

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

You can use a USB receiver to connect to your laptop.

Don't I need to connect the laptop to the satellite antenna ?
As it's a laptop, it not always at the same location, so may not always be able to connect to a satellite antenna. How big are these satellite antennas (e.g., do you need a roof for them, or a window facing a certain point in the sky ?)

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

Problem is, you will not get many channels in Hebrew, only from Amos satellite which have the same five DTT TV channels.
In fact, you can also receive the same DTT channels if you put a dish for Amos and another one for Hot Bird 13E.
See my profile on the left.

Thanks,
Ron.

**HB13DISH** · 07-09-2009

Originally Posted by ronbarak

I'm not a big TV consumer (actually, my TV broke a year ago and I never got around to fix it :-)
That's why I thought the DVB-T USB would be nice, in case I do want to watch the odd programme.

Don't I need to connect the laptop to the satellite antenna ?
As it's a laptop, it not always at the same location, so may not always be able to connect to a satellite antenna. How big are these satellite antennas (e.g., do you need a roof for them, or a window facing a certain point in the sky ?)

Thanks,
Ron.

If you can manage with only the five TV channels, then you don't need anything else. But you did ask what can be a better alternative, so I gave it to you.
The satellite dish has to be south facing, so look for neighboring Yes dishes, and this should tell you how to position a satellite dish.
From the dish, you can can connect an LNB with four or more outputs and run coaxial cables to each place you are likely to be, and just connect/disconnect accordingly.
Let's hope you get the DVB-T working first.

ronbarak · 08-09-2009

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

If you can manage with only the five TV channels, then you don't need anything else. But you did ask what can be a better alternative, so I gave it to you.
The satellite dish has to be south facing, so look for neighbouring Yes dishes, and this should tell you how to position a satellite dish.
From the dish, you can can connect an LNB with four or more outputs and run coaxial cables to each place you are likely to be, and just connect/disconnect accordingly.
Let's hope you get the DVB-T working first.

Looking on the internet _http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television_channel_frequencies#Western_Europe.2C_G reenland.2C_most_countries_in_Asia_and_Africa.2C_a nd_most_of_Oceania , I found that: in Western Europe, Greenland, most countries in Asia and Africa, and most of Oceania
System D/G/H 625 lines (8 MHz / channel) UHF band: Channel 29 is 535.25 540.75.
Alas, when I tried scanning these particular frequencies, I got the same results as for scanning the whole spectrum, which is 0 live channels found.
I tried at the place my TV antenna is located, and got the same negative results.
So, for now I'm stumped: I don't know if the problem is coverage (I tried in Hadar, Haifa), or if the TVB card is not scanning the correct frequencies, or if the TVB is faulty :-)
Bye,
Ron.

**HB13DISH** · 08-09-2009

Originally Posted by ronbarak

Looking on the internet _http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television_channel_frequencies#Western_Europe.2C_G reenland.2C_most_countries_in_Asia_and_Africa.2C_a nd_most_of_Oceania , I found that: in Western Europe, Greenland, most countries in Asia and Africa, and most of Oceania
System D/G/H 625 lines (8 MHz / channel) UHF band: Channel 29 is 535.25 540.75.
Alas, when I tried scanning these particular frequencies, I got the same results as for scanning the whole spectrum, which is 0 live channels found.
I tried at the place my TV antenna is located, and got the same negative results.
So, for now I'm stumped: I don't know if the problem is coverage (I tried in Hadar, Haifa), or if the TVB card is not scanning the correct frequencies, or if the TVB is faulty :-)
Bye,
Ron.

Hi Ron,
I meant to ask you yesterday if you bought the stick in Israel or ordered it from abroad.
The reason I am asking, is that if a product is being sold in Israel, then it should be compatible with the transmission spec. While any another product may not be compatible, as different countries have different DTT standards.
You could try taking your laptop to the roof (with battery fully charged), as you are bound to have a much better signal, and point your antenna in the direction of Jerusalem and hopefully you might pick up something.
Once you get a lock on the signal, you can then move about in your apartment and see where you get the best signal.
Please attach the spec or user manual of your stick and I will take a look at it.
There is also a possibility that the reception in your area is still not covered.
At this stage I wouldn't worry about it being faulty.

ronbarak · 08-09-2009

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

Hi Ron,
I meant to ask you yesterday if you bought the stick in Israel or ordered it from abroad.
The reason I am asking, is that if a product is being sold in Israel, then it should be compatible with the transmission spec. While any another product may not be compatible, as different countries have different DTT standards.

It's bought from a seller in China. The core of the USB is Intel® CE 9500 DVB-T Digital Terrestrial TV Receiver Solution for PCs (see _http://download.intel.com/design/celect/refdesign/31543301.pdf for more details)

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

You could try taking your laptop to the roof (with battery fully charged), as you are bound to have a much better signal, and point your antenna in the direction of Jerusalem and hopefully you might pick up something.
Once you get a lock on the signal, you can then move about in your apartment and see where you get the best signal.
Please attach the spec or user manual of your stick and I will take a look at it.

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

There is also a possibility that the reception in your area is still not covered.
At this stage I wouldn't worry about it being faulty.

I live in Hadar HaCarmel, Haifa, and I was under the impression that Haifa is covered.
Thanks for all the help,
Ron.

**HB13DISH** · 09-09-2009

Originally Posted by ronbarak

It's bought from a seller in China. The core of the USB is Intel® CE 9500 DVB-T Digital Terrestrial TV Receiver Solution for PCs (see _http://download.intel.com/design/celect/refdesign/31543301.pdf for more details)

I live in Hadar HaCarmel, Haifa, and I was under the impression that Haifa is covered.
Thanks for all the help,
Ron.

Can you attach the user guide of the gadget or it's specifications?
Perhaps it came with the package in CD-R?
I don't think the Intel core is what I need at the moment.

ronbarak · 09-09-2009

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

Can you attach the user guide of the gadget or it's specifications?
Perhaps it came with the package in CD-R?
I don't think the Intel core is what I need at the moment.

I'm attaching the manual from the CD.
Two notes:

I noticed that the driver on the CD has a different name (CE6230BDA.sys) than the name in device manager.
I tried to scan at Nesher, and still no live channel was found.

**HB13DISH** · 09-09-2009

I have a bad feeling that this gadget supports Video in MPEG-II and our DTT transmision is in MPEG-IV (MPEG4)
Check this device from Bartalsat
_http://www.bartalsat.co.il/site/detail/detail/detailDetail.asp?detail_id=1253977

**HB13DISH** · 09-09-2009

Originally Posted by ronbarak

I'm attaching the manual from the CD.
Two notes:
I noticed that the driver on the CD has a different name (CE6230BDA.sys) than the name in device manager.

I tried to scan at Nesher, and still no live channel was found.

This manual doesn't show the DVB-T spec.
Can you please confirm it supports only MPEG-2?

**HB13DISH** · 09-09-2009

The Post Office is selling the USB dongle version for 219 NIS (including remote). I haven't been to my local PO lately, so I don't know if this is already available in Haifa for example.
You should check if this product has Hebrew support.
_http://www.israelpost.co.il/shop.nsf/productsdisplay.xml?openpage&cat=2~

ronbarak · 10-09-2009

Originally Posted by HB13DISH

This manual doesn't show the DVB-T spec.
Can you please confirm it supports only MPEG-2?

The block diagram in _http://download.intel.com/design/celect/refdesign/31543301.pdf Intel® CE 9500 shows MPEG Out, but does not indicate which version of MPEG. Same with _http://download.intel.com/design/celect/prodbrf/31543101.pdf" Intel® CE 6230 USB 2.0. I'll try to find which MPEG this chipset supports.

A DTT nubee question: Israel is using MPEG4. If the DVB-T card does not support MPEG4, when stations' scan is performed, will one get anything - or won't the live stations be found ?

Also, I tried scanning with another (different) DVB-T card, and I got the same negative results (0 stations found).
Is there a URL showing exact coverage in Haifa area (down to street names and house numbers granularity?), so I can eliminate the "not covered" cause for my inability to connect ?

Thanks,
Ron.

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DTT Started in Israel Information exchange on Freeview, Freeview HD, Digital Terrestrial Television and analogue broadcasts.

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