Best non-Sky receiver?

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Copenhagen
#1
Can anyone recommend a non-Sky digital receiver that's as good as the Panasonic TU-DSB-30 for picking up the BBC channels on Astra 2D. I currently own a Sony 750U skybox, and a Force 1122s (viaccess/conax). Now that ITV, channel4 and five are about to be swithched off, I'd be happier with 1 box for all channels. I'm getting roughly the same signal quality on both receivers, and I've read that the Sony is not great with fringe reception (although not having another Sky box to compare with I can't confirm or dispute this).

Does the fact that the transponders the BBC uses on 2D are relatively low frequency, have any relevance when choosing a receiver? As many of us have experienced, the choice of LNB in fringe areas is critical. Is this aslo the case with receivers? Does the Panasonic TU-DSB30 excel accross the whole frequency spectrum, or is it just better on the low frequencies?

DKBrit
 

geoffreys

ASBO Club Member - Persona non grata
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Famaval 2.4m dish, Invacom 0.2dB LNB (single), Pace 430N
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Famagusta District, Cyprus
#2
DKBrit said:
Can anyone recommend a non-Sky digital receiver that's as good as the Panasonic TU-DSB-30 for picking up the BBC channels on Astra 2D. I currently own a Sony 750U skybox, and a Force 1122s (viaccess/conax). Now that ITV, channel4 and five are about to be swithched off, I'd be happier with 1 box for all channels. I'm getting roughly the same signal quality on both receivers, and I've read that the Sony is not great with fringe reception (although not having another Sky box to compare with I can't confirm or dispute this).

Does the fact that the transponders the BBC uses on 2D are relatively low frequency, have any relevance when choosing a receiver? As many of us have experienced, the choice of LNB in fringe areas is critical. Is this aslo the case with receivers? Does the Panasonic TU-DSB30 excel accross the whole frequency spectrum, or is it just better on the low frequencies?

DKBrit
How do you mean when ITV, Ch4, and Ch5 are switched off?? What satellite or beam are they moving to?
Geoff
 
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#3
geoffreys said:
How do you mean when ITV, Ch4, and Ch5 are switched off?? What satellite or beam are they moving to?
Geoff
Sorry! When my solus card is switched off - I'm getting the message that the card is soon to be turned off.

DKBrit
 

geoffreys

ASBO Club Member - Persona non grata
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My Satellite Setup
Famaval 2.4m dish, Invacom 0.2dB LNB (single), Pace 430N
My Location
Famagusta District, Cyprus
#4
DKBrit said:
Sorry! When my solus card is switched off - I'm getting the message that the card is soon to be turned off.

DKBrit
OK, thanks for that clarification - you had me worried for a moment!
Geoff
 

rolfw

Believe it when I see it Admin.
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Technomate 5402 HD M2 Ci, DM7000s, Transparent 80cm Dish, Moteck SG2100 DiseqC motor, lots of legacy gear. Meters: Satlook Digital NIT, Promax HD Ranger+ spectrum analyser.
My Location
Berkshire
#5
DKBrit said:
Does the Panasonic TU-DSB30 excel accross the whole frequency spectrum, or is it just better on the low frequencies?

DKBrit
It is generally a more selective tuner, so can still see a weak signal when nearly swamped by stronger ones and probably won't be as much of an advantage as it would be for those requiring a very large dish to pull in the signals.

Most good quality receivers should suffice in your location, the best way to improve your reception is to look at increasing your dish size if possible and possibly tweak the skew or upgrade your LNB.
 

workshoppete

Here Now And Again
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1 metre motorised dish ,Technomate V-box, Spiderbox 7000HD box, Windows0n desktop and laptop,. and couldnt live without Promax Prodig 5 TV Explorer.. Oh , and now ipad - so much easier and convenient
My Location
North Midlands
#6
A point to note is that it is correct that the BBC channels are broadcast in the KU Low band.However because the universal LNB is switched between 10.6GHZ for high band and 9.75GHZ for low band, it means that the IF range is also switched to a different set of frequencies. In effect what happens is that the low band frequencies are relayed from the LNB at a HIGHER range of frequencies than that of the high band.The significance is apparrant when there is a long cable run from the dish to the satellite receiver,the higher block of frequencies (and therefore the LOW band) are attenuated more than the lower block.This impacts on the BBC channels as they are broadcast in the Low band and as a consequence are typically received at the satellite tuner at a much lower power level than the High band channels. Clearly the amount of attenuation along the cable between LNB to satellite tuner is dependant on the local oscillator setting of the LNB, (and of the quality and length of the cable) the higher the setting the less the attennuation.
Note :- The IF frequency is determined by the frequency of the incoming signal to the LNB minus the local oscillator frequency. ie 12.00GHz incoming would be mixed with a 10.7 GHZ local oscillator to produce an IF frequency of 1.3GHZ (1300MHZ). Note that typically the changeover point for the band is 11.7GHZ- ie anything under 11.7GHZ is switched to low band Anything above 11.7GHZ is switched to high band
An interesting point to observe is when measuring the power levels with a spectrum analyser. It is possible to measure the signal power levels of the lower band with both 22khz band switching applied and not applied The two measurements give 2 entirely different readings but both are absolutely correct! I guess you could improve your chances of picking up low band signals by purchasing a FTA receiver that you can alter the L.O frequency on . By raising the frequency of the low band oscillator slightly you will lower the IF frequency and therefore increase the signal level received by the satellite tuner.(however some of the channels would fall outside of the band because of this)
 

rolfw

Believe it when I see it Admin.
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Berkshire
#7
I would disagree with your conclusions I'm afraid (unless I've misinterpreted your post), as the BBC channels and in fact all of the channels on 2D are broadcast between 10.744 and 10.936, they are sent down the cable to the receiver after down conversion, at an IF of between 1Ghz and 1.186Ghz.

The BBC channels in particular London are broadcast at 10.773, so are sent to the receiver at just over 1Ghz, which means that they will not suffer from higher attenuation.

In fact, the converse is often the case in certain circumstances. We have a couple of members who have found that the attenuation of the much stronger high band signals by increasing the length of cable has aided their quest for the weaker 2D signals.
 

devonbrown

Specialist Contributor
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4 systems. In Scotland Freesat with Humax Foxsat recorder. In Algarve 1.5 fixed Inv Quad LNB with 3 Pace 2600C1 and 1 Amstrad HD DRX780UK also 80cm dish with Inverto 0.2db monoblock LNB (19.2E/26E) feeding Technomate 5000CI+ usb.
My Location
Scotlandl and Algarve
#8
I am in the Costa del Sol( a fringe area) I have 2 receivers. 1 is a panny 30 the other is a pace 2200. With both I receive all BBC channels ITV and CH5. with the panny I get ch4 but the pace gives pixelations and sometimes no sat sig. With the pace I receive Euronews and the God channels but with the Panny I very rarely receive them. Conclusion is that my Panasonic is not the best receiver for all frequencies.
 
Messages
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#9
devonbrown said:
I am in the Costa del Sol( a fringe area) I have 2 receivers. 1 is a panny 30 the other is a pace 2200. With both I receive all BBC channels ITV and CH5. with the panny I get ch4 but the pace gives pixelations and sometimes no sat sig. With the pace I receive Euronews and the God channels but with the Panny I very rarely receive them. Conclusion is that my Panasonic is not the best receiver for all frequencies.
This is as I suspected, the Panasonic is better at certain frequencies. I have tried 3 receivers and the results have been as follows with my 1.8m dish and a standard MTI blueline LNB (still waiting for c-120 MTI)...

Force 1122S....
picture 24/7 on 2D vertical transponders except in heavy rain
picture from 15:00 to 23:00 on 2D horizontal transponders in good weather

Sony 750U (skybox)....
picture most of the day on 2D vertical but not 24/7
picture only in the evening with occasional noise on 2D horizontal

Nokia 9802S....
picture with noise most of the day on vertical transponders, signal quality around 35-40%
No picture on horizontal transponders.

So there is a difference in the way the 3 different receivers can handle the same signal. The Nokia however is very good with a small dish on 1W and 5E. Better or at least as good as the Force.

Thanks for all the replies an information!

DKBrit
 
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