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How much signal do I need ?

koansrc

Regular Member
Messages
315
Likes
0
My Satellite Setup
CM 3.0m @ 28.2 w PACE
My Location
Athens-Greece
#1
By looking at the Eurobird1 fixed beam footiprint _http://www.astra2d.com/eurobird1-footprint.htm, my area (Athens) is in the 38 dBW area. My dish has gain of 43.0 dB and I can just about get channels from this beam (breakup with bad weather).

From the above is it not possible to calculate "how much signal my setup actually needs (minimum)" ?? and would that figure be absolute and true for any satellite ??
 

Topper

Amo Amas Amant Admin
Staff member
Messages
21,440
Likes
3,200
My Satellite Setup
IDD CI24 ECONO MM Penta 1.20 Galaxy II
1.2Mtr Polar MTG yes it has been on the arc for 25 years and is now fixed on 13 East using two pairs of rusty molegrips. Unlike me they never groan but always perform.
My Location
Blackburn, Lancashire
#2
koansrc said:
From the above is it not possible to calculate "how much signal my setup actually needs (minimum)" ?? and would that figure be absolute and true for any satellite ??
In my opinion why bother, there are far too many variables involved here, fringe reception is not an exact science and the reality is far different to the theoretical. Also you must consider that every few weeks the satellites (which effectively drift around within a theoretical box 5km x 5km) are repositioned thus whatever you calculated one week may change the next time the satellite is repositioned
 

koansrc

Regular Member
Messages
315
Likes
0
My Satellite Setup
CM 3.0m @ 28.2 w PACE
My Location
Athens-Greece
#3
Topper said:
In my opinion why bother...
So I guess it's another case of "buy the biggest dish you can possible afford and hope for the best" ...

I assume you don't actually live in the fringe reception area this forum is dedicated to and you have your 24x7 sky digital sorted out ?
 

Topper

Amo Amas Amant Admin
Staff member
Messages
21,440
Likes
3,200
My Satellite Setup
IDD CI24 ECONO MM Penta 1.20 Galaxy II
1.2Mtr Polar MTG yes it has been on the arc for 25 years and is now fixed on 13 East using two pairs of rusty molegrips. Unlike me they never groan but always perform.
My Location
Blackburn, Lancashire
#4
Firstly it was never my intention to upset you, which presumably, having read your reply, I have, I merely wanted to make you understand that for your location it has never ever been intended that you should receive the signals 24/7 therefore you can calculate and theorise all you like and you may still be disappointed so in this case your answer below I agree with

koansrc said:
So I guess it's another case of "buy the biggest dish you can possible afford and hope for the best" ...

koansrc said:
I assume you don't actually live in the fringe reception area this forum is dedicated to and you have your 24x7 sky digital sorted out ?
As you can see from my profile I do not but I watch that little of it perhaps you would like a house swap ;)

Just out of curiosity have you had a look at this site
 

koansrc

Regular Member
Messages
315
Likes
0
My Satellite Setup
CM 3.0m @ 28.2 w PACE
My Location
Athens-Greece
#5
Topper said:
As you can see from my profile I do not but I watch that little of it perhaps you would like a house swap ;)
So you don't live in a fringe reception area, you watch very little SKY and you wouldn't bother making any calculations regarding signal reception.

Ermm .... why do you post to this forum ?U-zzz
 

Topper

Amo Amas Amant Admin
Staff member
Messages
21,440
Likes
3,200
My Satellite Setup
IDD CI24 ECONO MM Penta 1.20 Galaxy II
1.2Mtr Polar MTG yes it has been on the arc for 25 years and is now fixed on 13 East using two pairs of rusty molegrips. Unlike me they never groan but always perform.
My Location
Blackburn, Lancashire
#6
koansrc said:
Ermm .... why do you post to this forum ?U-zzz
I post because I am a moderator on this forum and as such freely give my time helping others who want help and ensuring the forum rules are adhered to.
Your lack of replies to your question is probably indicative of the fact that your question is beyond the scope of a hobbyist forum.

If you wish to insult people I suggest you do it elsewhere
 

koansrc

Regular Member
Messages
315
Likes
0
My Satellite Setup
CM 3.0m @ 28.2 w PACE
My Location
Athens-Greece
#7
Topper said:
I post because I am a moderator on this forum and as such freely give my time helping others ...
You do not need to be a moderator in order to freely give your time to help others. But perhaps in your case, if you where not a moderator you would indeed not post.

Topper said:
Your lack of replies to your question is probably indicative of the fact that your question is beyond the scope of a hobbyist forum.
That may well be the case. Nothing wrong with that. That's the case with other posts of mine and others I'm sure e.g http://www.satellites.co.uk/satellite/dish-setup-single-sat-multi-sat-motorised-systems/94863-need-help-feedhorn-f-d.html#post591156 which got Zero replies. But let the post die out. Don't reply "In my opinion why bother..." and kill it.[/QUOTE]

Topper said:
If you wish to insult people I suggest you do it elsewhere
This is one of the most polite and well mannered lists I have come across and I have followed a few in the past 20years. I believe it must be a direct reflection of the average age of the moderators and loyal members. Wise and calm (perhaps too calm...). I personally have learnt alot posting and searching it's archives and have made my symbolic contribution as a personal "thanks www.satellites.co.uk". I think I will leave it here for now and indeed take my vague signal searching questions elsewhere.
 

billnot

Growing Old Disgracefully
Messages
242
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0
My Satellite Setup
Famaval 3,1, IP9000HD plus other FTA and Linux boxes - Astra 1&2, Hotbird, Hispasat
My Location
Benitachell, Alicante, Spain
#8
Trying to answer the original post, the way I'd approach it would be to try to find somebody else in the same area doing the same thing, and see what they're using. If they are getting everything OK, they obviously have a setup you can copy.

It isn't an exact science, and a good rule of thumb is that the bigger the dish the better.
 

dxsat

Specialist Contributor
Messages
745
Likes
70
My Satellite Setup
Snap's setup: (In Spain) Humax HDR, Prodelin 1.8m dish + Invacom QDF-031 + CM feed, (In UK) CallFlow VDSL + EE 4G, Sky Q, YouView HD, Mac OSX, iOS
My Location
UK: Tonbridge, Kent. Spain: Madrid.
#9
It is perfectly possible to calculate dish size for a given signal strength. The trouble is- no one on this forum knows how. (prove me wrong!) This question has been asked before. You can run a formula, factor in the LNB's gain, efficiency of dish, noise temperature etc and come out with a figure. You would still have to add a bit more size for a safety margin to get you over the reception threshold for when it is wet, or the signal is down slightly for some reason.
Changes in the sun's activity, interference from other channels and atmospheric pollution can also reduce what you get on the ground.
The one thing you can say for sure is:-
-Your dish: Tecatel own brand dishes are not the best, with only average gain.
-From your other post on F/D ratios (I have added a reply), you probably need a better LNB and feedhorn.
 

deepbluesky

Specialist Contributor
Messages
997
Likes
72
My Satellite Setup
Octagon Quad Optima OQSLO @ Laminas OFC-1100 @ Powertech DG-380 @ Vu+ Solo²(OpenATV) / Technotrend S2-1600
Sony KDL32W656A / TBS 6220 (DVB-C)
Terratec T-Stick+ (DAB+)
My Location
Stuttgart (48.79N/9.19E)
#10
Just to clear it up: You need at least 1.50m Offset in Athens to get all of Eurobird 1 24/7. A smaller dish will lose some frequencies. Even this size cannot guarantee on rainy days perfect reception, that's why some people got a 1.80m.