Inferior tuner or software?

dmaavrigdo

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Yesterday, there being a clear sky, I compared the performance of my Zgemma H9S (Tuner Si2166D) and TM Nano M3 (Tuner BCM7362). Both running OpenVix.
The Nano saw, for example, Sky News and Dave at 10db and the Zgemma didn't see them at all. It does detect a couple of transponders in the high band so the easy answer is out of the window.
Is there a way I can drop the threshold on the Zgemma and see if it is the software or the tuner?
Any opinions?
 

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I trust you have swopped both receivers over, rather than using a two way splitter, or run in series through the tuner loop.

A 10dB threshold should be ample , does the Nano have a BEC or Eb/No figure that you can attach ?
 

dmaavrigdo

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I trust you have swopped both receivers over, rather than using a two way splitter, or run in series through the tuner loop.

A 10dB threshold should be ample , does the Nano have a BEC or Eb/No figure that you can attach ?
Yes. Swapped.
 

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If you haven't got a dedicated attenuator for IF application, do you have a spare 30m of cable you could add inline with the exsting run ?

What frequencies are not coming in (sorry, being lazy), but it might be a notch caused by the motor, or perhaps the LNB/cable type, I am currently setting up a similar test on another thread (27W)
 

dmaavrigdo

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Screenshot_2020-04-05 Zgemma H9S - OpenWebif.pngScreenshot_2020-04-05 Technomate TM-NANO M3 - OpenWebif.png
The Nano shows higher numbers even on loop thru.
 

dmaavrigdo

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If you haven't got a dedicated attenuator for IF application, do you have a spare 30m of cable you could add inline with the exsting run ?

What frequencies are not coming in (sorry, being lazy), but it might be a notch caused by the motor, or perhaps the LNB/cable type, I am currently setting up a similar test on another thread (27W)
No motor.
The channels not showing are all high band. Only a couple lock 11778 v 11914h 12344h. The UHD demos work fine!
On the low band pass through works as I expect it should If I select a horizontal chanel on the Zgemma I can watch any horizontal transponder on the Nano.
 

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The Si2166D tuner chip is mounted by the Octagon SF8008 Twin, it is a good tuner mounted on this receiver.
But mounted on the Zgemma H9S, everyone says the same, it is deaf, apart from measuring less.
This is where you see the quality of the circuit and the electronics, also of the divers that manage it.

A colleague has problems with the Astra 1L at 19'2ºE, TP12515 H 22000, it does not have a signal with a 60cm antenna.
With the old GT-Media receiver without problems the commented tp.
It is clear that the antenna is not well centered to the 4 satellites of this position, the new receiver with the current signal level in this TP is completely blind.
He recommends better adjusting the antenna/LNB to compensate for the tuner threshold problem.
I will comment how the movie ends.
---------------------
El chip del tuner Si2166D lo monta el Octagon SF8008 Twin, es buen tuner montado en este receptor.
Pero montado en el Zgemma H9S, todos dicen lo mismo, es mas sordo, aparte de medir menos.
Aqui es donde se ve la calidad del circuito y la electronica, tambien de los diver que lo manejan.

Un compañero tienes problemas con el Astra 1L a 19'2ºE, TP12515 H 22000, no tiene señal con antena de 60cm.
Con el viejo receptor GT-Media sin problemas el tp comentado.
Esta claro que no tiene la antena bien centrada a los 4 satelites de esta posicion, el nuevo receptor con el nivel de señal actual en este TP esta completamente ciego.
Recomende ajustar mejor la antena/LNB y compensar asi el problema del umbral del sintonizador.
Ya comentare que tal termina la pelicula.
 

Tururu

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Recycled as the owner.
My Location
North of Madrid (28703 Spain) -3Km of IKEA (40.545847, -3.612012).:-)
Octagon SF8008 Twin, Si2166D, 90cm (motor) Madrid (spain).

28E.png
 

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I have just seen mention of different colour casings for the tuner module (silver or grey) denote different chip production.

Elsewhere on the web there are posts suggesting ‘B and ‘D’ versions of the tuner chip are present in Zgemma boxes depending on where they come from
 
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dmaavrigdo

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My Satellite Setup
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Octagon SF8008 twin
Yamaha HTR-2067
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Vansbro Sweden
The Si2166D tuner chip is mounted by the Octagon SF8008 Twin, it is a good tuner mounted on this receiver.
But mounted on the Zgemma H9S, everyone says the same, it is deaf, apart from measuring less.
This is where you see the quality of the circuit and the electronics, also of the divers that manage it.

A colleague has problems with the Astra 1L at 19'2ºE, TP12515 H 22000, it does not have a signal with a 60cm antenna.
With the old GT-Media receiver without problems the commented tp.
It is clear that the antenna is not well centered to the 4 satellites of this position, the new receiver with the current signal level in this TP is completely blind.
He recommends better adjusting the antenna/LNB to compensate for the tuner threshold problem.
I will comment how the movie ends.
---------------------
El chip del tuner Si2166D lo monta el Octagon SF8008 Twin, es buen tuner montado en este receptor.
Pero montado en el Zgemma H9S, todos dicen lo mismo, es mas sordo, aparte de medir menos.
Aqui es donde se ve la calidad del circuito y la electronica, tambien de los diver que lo manejan.

Un compañero tienes problemas con el Astra 1L a 19'2ºE, TP12515 H 22000, no tiene señal con antena de 60cm.
Con el viejo receptor GT-Media sin problemas el tp comentado.
Esta claro que no tiene la antena bien centrada a los 4 satelites de esta posicion, el nuevo receptor con el nivel de señal actual en este TP esta completamente ciego.
Recomende ajustar mejor la antena/LNB y compensar asi el problema del umbral del sintonizador.
Ya comentare que tal termina la pelicula.
Thanks for an informative reply.
I will stop beating my head against the wall.
 
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dmaavrigdo

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Tururu

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Recycled as the owner.
My Location
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Check last night where you live (forum/public data) and the antenna measurement you use.
The TM, with the signal levels well according to the photo.
If Zgemma is deaf, that has no solution as long as you do not put more antenna.
Comment on the theme of the octagon in case you have a friend who has it and you can prove in your installation how it behaves with the signal you have.
Another option is to ask for Amazon and if wrong, return.

I'm not saying anything for the UK beam from Madrid (Spain), I'm lucky to be at a signal peak with 125cm, fine. Change the IBU from 0.2dB for saturation problems at 11053H, the rest fine overall.
A few years ago, I did this test with 45208 tuner chip on VU+ and Qviart Lunix3 4K.
The deaf Lunix3 with UK beam channels (28E).
VU+ OK.
I use this 28E satellite, do UK for tuner quality testing.
---------------
Revise anoche donde vives (datos foro/publicos) y la medida de antena que usas.
El TM, con los niveles de señal bien segun foto.
Si Zgemma es mas sordo, eso no tiene solucion mientras no pongas mas antena.
Comente el tema del octagon por si tienes algun amigo que lo tenga y puedas probar en tu instalacion que tal se porta con la señal que tienes.
Otra opcion es pedir por Amazon y si mal, devolver.

No digo nada para el haz UK desde Madrid (españa), tengo la suerte de estar en un pico de señal con 125cm, bien. Cambie el IBU de 0'2dB por los problemas de saturacion en 11053H, el resto bien en general.
Hace unos años, realice esta prueba con tuner chip 45208 en VU+ y Qviart Lunix3 4K.
El Lunix3 sordo con los canales del haz UK (28E).
VU+ OK.
Uso este satelite 28E, haz UK para las pruebas de calidad de los tuner.
28E_1.png
 

dmaavrigdo

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My Satellite Setup
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Check last night where you live (forum/public data) and the antenna measurement you use.
The TM, with the signal levels well according to the photo.
If Zgemma is deaf, that has no solution as long as you do not put more antenna.
Comment on the theme of the octagon in case you have a friend who has it and you can prove in your installation how it behaves with the signal you have.
Another option is to ask for Amazon and if wrong, return.

I'm not saying anything for the UK beam from Madrid (Spain), I'm lucky to be at a signal peak with 125cm, fine. Change the IBU from 0.2dB for saturation problems at 11053H, the rest fine overall.
A few years ago, I did this test with 45208 tuner chip on VU+ and Qviart Lunix3 4K.
The deaf Lunix3 with UK beam channels (28E).
VU+ OK.
I use this 28E satellite, do UK for tuner quality testing.
---------------
Revise anoche donde vives (datos foro/publicos) y la medida de antena que usas.
El TM, con los niveles de señal bien segun foto.
Si Zgemma es mas sordo, eso no tiene solucion mientras no pongas mas antena.
Comente el tema del octagon por si tienes algun amigo que lo tenga y puedas probar en tu instalacion que tal se porta con la señal que tienes.
Otra opcion es pedir por Amazon y si mal, devolver.

No digo nada para el haz UK desde Madrid (españa), tengo la suerte de estar en un pico de señal con 125cm, bien. Cambie el IBU de 0'2dB por los problemas de saturacion en 11053H, el resto bien en general.
Hace unos años, realice esta prueba con tuner chip 45208 en VU+ y Qviart Lunix3 4K.
El Lunix3 sordo con los canales del haz UK (28E).
VU+ OK.
Uso este satelite 28E, haz UK para las pruebas de calidad de los tuner.
View attachment 129459
Now I have the answer to my puzzle I am satisfied.
My wife is happy with the Zgemma and does not care about any of the missing channels.
 

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Now I have the answer to my puzzle I am satisfied.
My wife is happy with the Zgemma and does not care about any of the missing channels.

If you do get the opportunity to throw the H9S against a hard object such as a hammer, or the floor, can you take pictures of the internals and post them here ?

Thanks
 
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dmaavrigdo

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After research I see that the Si 2166 is not the tuner but a "DVB-S/S2/S2X Digital TV Demodulator" and it gets its inputs from a tuner/tuners .
"A zero-IF interface (differential) allows for a seamless connection to market proven satellite silicon tuners"
I'm not ready yet to lever the cover off the tuner module so don't know which one it is.
I have looked at the data sheet of one such tuner the MAX2112 and see that it's gain can be controlled by the SPI interface or the voltage on a pin. So a brave experimenter could possibly add a potentiometer! Perhaps there is a file to modify. Haven't found it yet.
 

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Go on, take both off.

Take photos

(the internals, not the happy wife) :D
 

dmaavrigdo

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Go on, take both off.

Take photos

(the internals, not the happy wife) :D
I tried a few shots but they were useless. Need a camera steady and remote.
The Si2166 is black and not inside the tuner can.
 

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The receiver lid, and the tuner canister
 

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i recently bought an H9S, as i read it supported blindscan - it was pathetic, WOEFUL in fact - didnt find anything (and i mean anything) on western sats, had it for 2 days, and sent back!!!
 

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The receiver lid, and the tuner canister
Well, since nobody else has stepped up to the plate.

Tuner has the RT720 inside, with complementary SI2166 (though without the 'D' suffix).

Build quality is somewhat better than the critics suggest.
 

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