Motorhome Dish Search Criteria

StevenJay

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Hi All,
New to this Forum so sorry if I am doing things wrong.
I have a Teleco Magic Sat 2002A Motorised dish which I am setting up to have a TV LNB set to 28.2 and a KuBand iLNB set to 23.5. Teleco will not release the search Criteria for 23.5 saying I need to buy a new controller box.
The Criteria for 28.2 are:
Criteria Freq. Polar. Signal Mode
1. 12207 mhz V YES Digital
2. 10714 mhz H NO Analog
3. 11200 mhz V NO Digital
4. 11307 mhz H YES Digital

Does anybody recognise where these figures may come from and how they should be changed to search for the 23.5 beam which will be very much easier than searching for the 28.5 beam with the left LNB and hoping it is good enough for the more precise aiming of the 23.5 beam on the centre iLNB.
Thanks for any suggestions you can give.
StevenJay
 

Analoguesat

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Hello Steven, welcome to the forum.

You can ignore any analogue settings - the last few analogue transmissions were turned off in 2012. All transmissions are now digital.

The frequencies in use at 23.5E are slightly different than at 28E - for instance the lowest frequency in use for tv is 11739V.

FlySat Astra 3B @ 23.5° East suggest that if you use

11836H 27500 YES Digital
11973V 27500 YES Digital
12070H27500 YES Digital
12168V 27500 YES Digital

that should give you a selection of clear & scrambled channels. There is a long thread on here as well which I will try to find which may help
 

StevenJay

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Thanks Very much @Analoguesat fantastic quick reply I will go out and try that now and thanks for the link, that didn't come up when I searched only a very old one. There is a lot to read so for this evening. Perhaps I can get to understand where the figures come from.
Interesting the figures I gave for 28.2 work for me but it takes a bit of time, found it better to use 8W to lock to first so the box knows where it is then search for 28.2E but the figures on that thread are totally different so may work better.
I presume it would be best to move my discussion over to there or can you move my posts there so others can benefit as well.
Thanks again.
Steve
 

Analoguesat

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Its probably better this one stays seperate, although I'll make a post on that other thread to point to this one so anyone looking for similar help in the future can see this one too.

To break the figures down -

11836H 27500 YES Digital

11836 - the transmission frequency in MHz (can also be written as 11.836GHz but on this forum most contributors tend to use the MHz figure

H is the transmission polarity (V= vertical, H= horizontal You may also see L&R = left & right circular polarity but these are not used in western Europe so you can safely ignore them on your system)

27500 is the "symbol rate" The exact details dont really matter, you just need to put in the appropriate figures that the charts give.

Not needed on your system but you will see things like1/2, 2/3, 3/4, 5/6, & 7/8 on the charts. These are the FEC = forward error correction. A fec of 3/4 means 3 in 4 of the transmission bits are programming with 1 in 4 being used to correct errors in the broadcast chain. Some receivers need these putting in , many modern ones just ignore them and put them in automatically.

Yes/No presumably means an active or inactive frequency - the broadcasters do move channels around on frequencies & satellites, most of which is invisible to the end user. Just us hobbyists watch out for these!

Analogue/digital is obvious. No analogue transmissions in Europe now so all settings should be digital.
 

Analoguesat

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Oh btw - dont get disheartened if it doesnt work first time - on the other thread we had to work round some technical issues which took a while although we did get there in the end!

Someone out there has the info you need to get set up, and with the level of expertise we have with our contributors here we can make some educated guesses as to where any problems might be occurring.
 

StevenJay

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Hi @Analoguesat, I have my Internet modem and iLNB and made up the double clamp fine.
I can lock on to Astra-2 at 28.2 fine with about 90% signal & 90% quality with the second LNB but would like to do the initial setting up with the iLNB turning to Astra-3 at 23.5. You gave me the figures below:

11836H 27500 YES Digital
11973V 27500 YES Digital
12070H27500 YES Digital
12168V 27500 YES Digital

But they do lock on to something but are a few degrees out so it is obviously locking on to the wrong satellite in a cluster perhaps the dutch TV rather than the Internet stream. I have the same problem with the professional meter I have borrowed which shows the satellite is there but will not lock on when pointed at the internet stream using the supplied bleeper and when the modem is locked on..
How are those figures above derived? Perhaps there are some others that may work better. It really is so frustrating I managed a full lock on both 28.2 and 23.5 yesterday but had to dismantle the clamp to clean it up and paint it etc. but after that can now not get the lock.
Another odd thing is that the original clamp and arm as set by Teleco points about 10 cm below the actual centre of the dish, is that usual? I can find no references to it at all.
The criteria I am using for 28.2 are the ones published by Teleco rather than those found by the contributors on the other thread.
Thanks for any ideas you have.
Steve
 

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BlindFaith

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11836H for sure is not a good choice. This frequency is active on both satellites with the same modulation parameters. Same for 12070H.
 

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Hi @Analoguesat, I have my Internet modem and iLNB and made up the double clamp fine.
I can lock on to Astra-2 at 28.2 fine with about 90% signal & 90% quality with the second LNB but would like to do the initial setting up with the iLNB turning to Astra-3 at 23.5. You gave me the figures below:

11836H 27500 YES Digital
11973V 27500 YES Digital
12070H27500 YES Digital
12168V 27500 YES Digital

But they do lock on to something but are a few degrees out so it is obviously locking on to the wrong satellite in a cluster perhaps the dutch TV rather than the Internet stream. I have the same problem with the professional meter I have borrowed which shows the satellite is there but will not lock on when pointed at the internet stream using the supplied bleeper and when the modem is locked on..
How are those figures above derived? Perhaps there are some others that may work better. It really is so frustrating I managed a full lock on both 28.2 and 23.5 yesterday but had to dismantle the clamp to clean it up and paint it etc. but after that can now not get the lock.
Another odd thing is that the original clamp and arm as set by Teleco points about 10 cm below the actual centre of the dish, is that usual? I can find no references to it at all.
The criteria I am using for 28.2 are the ones published by Teleco rather than those found by the contributors on the other thread.
Thanks for any ideas you have.
Steve


Morning Steve, yes those were the tv streams for identification purposes.

Im not sure exactly how those antenna systems work but Id guess that once you have found the correct tv streams you can change to the internet frequencies which like smoggy 2 posts above this one I would imagine are the "SES Broadband" ones.
 

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Steve

Please confirm you are in Languedoc Ferance and not some place else (plus the dish size on your motorhome). There is a chance some transponders are not available at your location.
 

StevenJay

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Thanks @smoggy07 @BlindFaith @Analoguesat & @Channel Hopper ,
I did a reply yesterday but it has not appeared yet for some reason, maybe because my present internet is so bad it got lost on the way!!
I looked at the two sites and got 8 frequencies which I will try but all are Horizontal so maybe the internet uses Horizontal for down and Vertical for the up stream. Wish I knew just what the dish needs to be able to search.
I take note of the duplicate frequencies and will look at the SES streams on 28.2 to eliminate duplicates which would confuse the searching.
Yes @Channel Hopper I am in the Languedoc in Southern France France. 43.3N, 2.6E but want to get this sorted to head down to Spain for Christmas and Jan - Feb with internet access.
It would be really nice @Analoguesat to know just how the Teleco searching algorithm works so as to isolate the best frequencies. I couldn't establish from the other thread whether anybody worked that out.
I think that I only need to lock on to the 23.5 streams for the initial setting up of the centre iLNB then set up the side LNB for 28.2 and then search for 28.2 from then on which will align the Centre iLNB at the same time. Which I am told works fine if the initial setting up is spot on.
This really is an enormous learning curve for me and I am very grateful for you guys helping me through it.
I think if we succeed it will be very useful for many people as Teleco are so very unhelpful, they say it is not possible and I have to buy a new system. They really do not do themselves any service at all.
Thanks again,
Steve
 

StevenJay

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Oh Sorry @Channel Hopper it is an 80cm offset dish this is it below and my twin LNB clamps.
Interestingly when I initially set it up by measurement alone I set the dish to find Astra-2 at 28.2 which it found with 90% Signal & 90% Quality on Sky and also a full lock on the internet. So I took it apart again to paint some bits and change some bolts to stainless which I had since bought but after re-assembling it I can now no longer find either 28.2 or 23.5. Really frustrating but at least I know it is possible where I am. And interestingly I also had BBC 1 & 2 and Chanels 4 & 5 which should need a 1.1 mtr dish down here.
The other question I asked above. The Blue spot on the dish is where the LNB's point as originally set up by Teleco. The red spot is the centre of the dish. Should I point them at the centre or leave them aiming below.
Steve

My-Dish_Small.jpg My_LNB_Clamps_Small.jpg
 

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Apologies, I've been elsewhere and didn't see your last message.

Since the two LNBs are about 90 degrees from each other, is it possible you have reset the polarity settngs in the receiver set up ? If so you will to customise at least one of the inputs to recognise opposite polarity settings, or tune manually, I guess the prime pocus LNB is the one that requires custom tuning.

Did you take any images before you dismantled the system ?
 

StevenJay

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Hi @Channel Hopper,
Thanks for that, the photo above is before I dismantled it when both were working. I don't understand what you mean that the LNB's are 90deg from each other. They are both set to the correct skew for my location.
How could I have reset the polarity, it is auto seek and I just set it to seek what I had hoped was 23.5E with the prime focus LNB hoping the Transponder frequencies I had chosen were correct.
Steve
 

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The LNB at the focal point looks 90 degrees off.
 

StevenJay

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Languedoc, France
Hi @Channel Hopper,
The Interactive LNB for the internet from 23.5E is designed to be sideways like that so as to leave room for the second LNB for TV from 28.2E. As you see the skew is at 20deg which is about right for here Languedoc France (20.6 theoretically). I have exactly the same iLNB on the second dish at home set at about 20deg and am getting internet fine.
I just need to get the right search criteria for the dish to lock on to 23.5E for initial setting up of the second LNB which will then be used to do the searching. My calculated dimensions which worked first time were 55 mm to the left (from front) and 21mm raised on an 8ocm dish.
I had an idea today when trying different criteria. The dish seemed to be finding the satellite far to quickly. I think it was just moving to the last memorised position rather than searching. I think on the other thread they had the same problem. It seems that the system is not properly forgetting the previous setting so I need to make sure it is doing that first.
Thanks for your help with this. I am determined not to let Teleco beat me!! ;) This Forum is certainly helping with that. :-applause
Steve
Twin_LNB_Skew_small.jpg Twin_LNB_small.jpg
 
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