Sat Meters

[geoffrey]

My last post came about because I could not get my Horizon HDSM to lock on anything at 28 east. There was no available file for the strongest transponder (2C) and nothing for 2B. The Horizon people sent me a file for Channel 4+1 on 2A North which locked a Satlook and a Skybox but not the HDSM - this was for 12480Ghz V.
Eventually Horizon let me have their SatEdit program (which I think is something that should be available as standard with the meter). With this its possible to define your own transponder frequencies and AFC ranges.
I then realized that the frequencies that Horizon were using for the Astra transponders did not correspond to the lock frequencies found by a Satlook Spectrum analyser.
If the frequencies found by the Satlook were used to define new Horizon files the meter worked fine - it will lock down to 3.3dB C/N and locks some transponders that the Satlook will not lock (ie Channel 4 on 12168v).
I then found that the frequencies shown by the Satlook differed from the published ones because my Invacom Quad LNB seems to have a LO which is offset by a few Mhz.
And its not just one LNB; I tried an Invacom Single,an Inverto Twin and an Invacom Single polarity with the following results for the locking frequencies indicated on a Satlook for Channel 5 on 10964H.
Invacom Quad QDF-031 : 10967
Inverto Twin 0.3dB : 10964
Invacom SPV-3SM : 10964
Invacom SNF-031 : 10967

The standard settings for the Horizon HDSM gives an AFC range of +-3Mhz which was just insufficient to cope with the Invacom Quad.

I hope this is of interest to someone - get the SatEdit file from Horizon technical support if you have similar problems. Trouble is that you need a Spectrum Analyser to first find the proper lock frequencies - maybe the new version of the Horizon with a spectrum display will help. This is the manual http://www.horizonhge.com/product_sheets/HDSM_USB_Manual.pdf

With this HDSM USB PLUS you can define one custom carrier with all the variations you can set with the SatEdit program; the spectrum display may be good enough to find the locking frequency.

 

[Zorba]

Very interesting. I also have the horizon and I am having problems with checking Invacom lnb's that are usually over a year old. The problem seems to be the local oscillator in the lnb does drift off a bit,especially on the high band. So on astra I do not get readings on the first two settings but i do on the fourth(horizontal low).
It is annoying and a collegue who has the same meter contacted Horizon a few weeks ago and was told that they acknowledge the problem with Invacom lnb's but there was no solution.
But if there is a program where we can put in our own frequencies then that would help.
Another colleague with same problem went and bought a roversat where you can store any frequency and step it up or down till it locks .
I also have the satlook but its a bulky thing to carry around (in front of a 3m dish) and the display is hard to see in sunlight.
This sat edit program sounds good. How do you get hold of it?

 

[geoffrey]

Interesting that we both had the same problem. After months of trying to get a working transponder file from Natalinna at Horizon my problem was passed on to Robert Sydee their Technical Manager. He was very helpful with suggestions and eventually sent me the SatEdit Program. His email is rob@horizonhge.com . It was Robert who suggested that the problem was with the LNB LO ; I thought that the published transponder frequencies were wrong ! I found that the SatEdit program would not run properly under Windows 98SE but worked fine under XP. I had to use a USB to serial port converter as the program did not recognise my serial port properly. Another point to note is that Windows XP may block the Zip file until you unblock it. Do this by right clicking on the file name, select properties and then unblock.

 

[Zorba]

Thanks geoffrey,I have just sent an email to Rob at Horizon. I didn't quote you yet,just to see what his reply will be.Then I will mention the sat edit program.

 

[sat man]

Hi Zorba,

I have the same sat. meter as you & Geoffrey and I'm having the same probs.I have contacted Rob at Horizon and Dave at Invacom about this problem and as you now know it's down to the meter. Interestingly if I fit a brand new invacom lnb I always get a full set of readings ie. BBC1, 2, ITV,CH 4 & 5 all locked on.
One thing, as you pointed out I wonder if we can make up our own hex. files which would work just for the invacom's using the new loader prog.
I'm thinking of getting the ROVER ST2 meter as an upgrade.

Cheers

 

[geoffrey]

Yes
With SatEdit - which is truly wonderful, you can make your own hex files. You download either directly to the meter or by making the usual sort of hex file. Also, its easy to make and save pre defined lists of transponders which you download to the meter as necessary.

 

[Zorba]

What did Invacom say about their lnb's ? Did they acknowledge that there is a problem ?

 

[sat man]

Hi,
No Dave @ invacom said quote ''I have to say that this is a strange one but if the LNB functions OK then it does sound like a meter problem. Difficult to say more without seeing the problem first hand.

 

[koansrc]

Does this "drifting" of the lnb(s) actually affect reception ? Should I be trying "add channels" +/- 3mhz on my digibox ?

 

[bignick]

I'm thinking of getting the ROVER ST2 meter as an upgrade.

Cheers

The ST2 is a fine meter - I had the S2 which is the same in Sat functionality. I think I chatted to you about the simplicity of the spectrum function. It certainly gives the S2 a large advantage over traditional sat meters such as the horizon or the Lacuna. I have recently upgraded up to the ST4 and, I the few times I have used it, have found it to be well worth the upgrade. At 2kg it is far lighter than the Satlook and isn't so affected by strong sunlight. The only slight nark that I have with it is that the spectrum is not rendered 'real time'. There is a very small but still significant delay to put the pattern on the colour screen - I wish it rendered as quickly as my old Satlook! I have adjusted my technique for searching the sat to compensate. One particularly good aspect of the meter is that I can watch FTA channels on the TFT display and reading on the LCD - this is handy for checking fine tune and transponder balance.

Hope that helps

Nick

 

[geoffrey]

One further point about the Horizon HDSM problem is that the AFC is affected by signal strength. With my Invacom Quad LNB a strong transponder such as Channel 5 on 10964H will lock the Horizon when set to this frequency if the AFC range is simply changed from 3000 to 4000 Hz. However, the very weak Channel 4+1 on 12480v does not lock whatever AFC range is chosen - but locks if the frequency is set to 12485v.

 

[Zorba]

The ST2 is a fine meter - I had the S2 which is the same in Sat functionality.

My colleague with the same Horizon as us went and bought the Roversat S2, not a bad meter because you can change the frequency up/down instantly and picks up signals which the Horizon doesn't.
I used to use my old faithful battered Promax spectrum analyser to to track the satellite,but half the switches are not working and I am in two minds about sending it away to be repaired.Its real time spectrum display is the best I have used.So I am using the Satlook now,but still having trouble getting ch4 (12.168v) .

 

[geoffrey]

My Satlook also will not lock on Ch 4 - but the Horizon does (when its set to 12173v) showing a C/N of 3.3dB and a Viterbi of 14%.

 

[Zorba]

I haven't had a reply yet from Rob@Horizon.I want this satedit program.

 

[iceman]

I haven't had a reply yet from Rob@Horizon.I want this satedit program.

Stop messing around with Satlook or Horizon & get yourself a decent professional meter

 

[sat man]

What would YOU recommend and why MR. Iceman

 

[iceman]

What would YOU recommend and why MR. Iceman

I personally use an old version Unaohm (EP314) but there are excellent modern meter-spectrum analyzers manufactured by Promax/Rover/Unaohm..
My advice is to Zorba or anyone else working with 2D in fringe areas...the advantage of a good meter+spectrum analyzer comes into play when dealing with very low signals.

 

[Zorba]

This is the problem,I bought what I was recommended.You don't find out the disadvantages straight away.
There's loads of makes/models in the magazines but if only we could try before we buy.
What might be good for someone in one country might be useless for someone elsewhere.
What I'm looking for is a Proroversatlook.(mark 3)

 

[geoffrey]

I asked Robert from Horizon if could pass on the SatEdit program. This was his reply today.

"I would appreciate if the software I provided to you was not put out on the web. I would prefer to issue the program from here. In the meantime I will create some Invacom specific selections and add them to the download page of the Horizon web site (these should appear over the next couple of days). In fact there is going to be quite a large update over the next few days.

Rob.

Best regards

Robert Sydee
Technical Manager
Horizon Global Electronics Ltd.
Unit 3 West Side
Flex Meadow
Harlow
Essex GB CM19 5TJ
United Kingdom

Tel: +44 (0)1279 417005
Fax: +44 (0)1279 417025
Email: rob@horizonhge.com
Web: www.horizonhge.com

 

[Zorba]

Geoffrey,is it possible for you to send the sat edit program on to me?