What do i need to recieve Bulgarian Sat TV

[pipiasisi]

Hi all,
I found this forum with Google. I live in Switzerland/Basel and I want to quit Cable and go on to Satellite.
I want to receive the following Satellites.
Hotbird 13E
W2 Eutelsat 16E
Astra 19.2E
Astra 28.2E
Hellas 39E (Bulsatcom)

I would like to have the Dish on my Balcony. Dont really want a Diseq Motor. I have heard that the Wavefrontier T90 are good.

I have chosen the Hellas Sat because it has I think more Bulgarian channels then the W2 Eutelsat 16E. I know that the Bulsatcom card can be bought in Bulgaria. I dont know about the ITV Partners card.

Will the Wavefrontier be enough for my needs? Will it maybe be easier or better when I ignore the Hellas Sat and just receive the Bulgarina channels over the W2 Eutelsat 16E? But then where will I get the ITV Partners card from?

How is the reception of Hellas in Switzerland? Does anyone know the coverage from Hellas?

As you can see, I am new to the Satellite theme. I appreciate your help and thoughts.

Greetings from Switzerland

 

[deepbluesky]

Hello southern neighbour,

Here in Stuttgart we installed with a friend a T90 that receives from 5W-39E having 16E in the center position. Although some transponders of 39E are sometimes on the limit they can be watched. But he has no Bulsatcom card so has no experience if these transponders make problems in bad weather conditions. If you don't want to use a Diseqc motor this dish is ideal for your needs. Since you don't want to go further west than 13E, you could aim more east than we did at 16E, say at 19.2E, 23.5E or even 26E. This way 39E gets stronger and you won't have any problems at all. The more east you center the dish the more skew it gets.

As for 39E only, 60cm are sufficient for most frequencies, but for full F1/F2 Beam reception at least 80cm are recommended here in Central Europe. This way you will have the optimum. For 13E/16E/19.2E/28.2E a 1m dish at 16E will do the job as well.

So it's up to you:
2 separate dishes or 1 T90 with a little limited 39E reception.

 

[pipiasisi]

Guten Nachmittag deepbluesky!

thank you for your quick comment.
I am pretty sure that I will take the T90. I like the looks of it and it is I think the best Dish out there.
What if I will put the Hellas 39E in the center and the rest next to it? Do you think that this would work?
Is it difficult to tune in the Satellites on the T90? Is there a Receiver that boosts the signals more then others?
What Receiver do you recommend? I heard that Vantage are good.

Grüsse aus der Schweiz
pipiasisi

 

[deepbluesky]

Grüezi pipiasisi,

I would not put 39E in the center position because of the following reasons:
1.) 16E would be far too weak
2.) The skew would rise up to 110°. This means that the dish should be turned 20° from its horizontal alignment. Not really a technical problem but maybe an asthetical.
3.) East of 39E there are only 2 positions that are of interest, 42E and 53E if we speak of regular programming and not feed hunting.

Have in mind that the T90 has its maximum gain not only in the 0° Offset position but in a broad area of +/-10°. This means that if you aim at 26E in the center just for example, then you will have roughly the performance of a common 90cm Offset dish in the intervall 16E-36E. 13E+39E would be about at 80cm level which should suffice for latter and more than enough for first. 39E/10956V is the weakest frequency (except of the ones from the S2 Beam) of what i read beeing transmitted in halftransponder mode, low SR and high FEC. In a german speaking board you might want to ask people with 80cm if they get this frequency as well. I have no 39E reception, so i cannot tell you for sure. Consider also 26E as center because of many interesting arab/english sport/movie/music stations that you can get in Basel easily with 90cm, at least Badr 3/4, not Eurobird 2 which is far weaker.

With my friend here it took us about 3h to install the T90 on his flat roof and fit the 8 LNBs in the right position. Just a small TV and a Dreambox (a receiver with quick changing signal quality and showing also low numbers for weak signal would have been better) were our equipment. 39E was in his configuration (16E center) extremely on the edge. I wouldn't say it was easy, because also of the weather conditions (a windy, showery and cold Feb day) but if you start it systematically i think you will do the job alone with a 2nd person to help. The alignment is of course more tricky than a simple 13E/19.2E dish but if you follow the rules mast 100% straight, elevation and skew of the center position and then tune in a strong frequency of the LNB position you might want to get, it should be a minor problem. We had a big problem only with the Diseqc switch that many people used with success. It was an EMP Centauri S.168 8/1 and we couldn't switch through all the positions. The configuration was right, the cabling brandnew, the F-connectors as well but the switch seemed to be faulty. Changing it to another model all worked fine. Spaun switches, as many installers say here, do make less problems.

As for the receiver i cannot recommend any since i haven't tested them all. It depends also on your needs.

Grüße aus dem Neckartal.

 

[deepbluesky]

I added some xls in which you can see at which position the LNBs should be. Depending on where you decide to set the center position, this window should be possible:

39E: 13E-66E which i wouldn't choose as i explained above.
26E: 3E-51E
16E: 5W-39E

 

[pipiasisi]

Good Morning deepbluesky,
until yesterday, I was 98% sure that i will get a T90. Last night I went to another Satellite Shop and I told the guy on what I want and that I was thinking about using a T90 to do this. He has recommended me a 100cm Gibertini dish with a Motor. He said that if for example the Bulsatcom will move to another Satellite, then it will be difficult to adjust the T90 to the new Satellite and the reception of a 100cm Gibertini dish is better then the T90. Also it is easier and cheaper to get more Satellites on a Dish with a Motor. Dont need to buy addtional LNB's and Diseq's.
I am also starting to think that this can be right. The 100cm Gibertini is larger then the T90 and I should receive the Hellas Sat better.

I am now to the stage where I am confused again. I have also started to dream about Satellite dishes

What are the advantges and disadvantages of both T90 and a Dish on a Motor?

Attached you will find the view from my balcony. From left to right. 1st pic is south then then pics 2+3 are going east from south. Does this look ok for my 5 satellites that I want? I dont know how low the Hellas Sat is.

Wishing you a great Weekend!

 

[deepbluesky]

Good day to Basel,

39E is >27° in elevation, so it would be only a problem if a tall tree or building would block the sight. It seems to me that this is not the case watching your pictures. 13E is about 35° in elevation so no need to worry. If you want to make your own calculations then take a look here: http://www.satlex.net/de/elobst_calc.html

Indeed, a 1m Gibertini would give you the maximum of gain on all positions. Even the center position the T90 performs a little less, at the edges +/-25° you can compare it with a 50cm. The pros of a T90 are that you have instant zapping without the need to wait some seconds until the dish moves in worst case from 13E to 39E. I'd say, a T90 takes a little more time to install it compared to a Diseqc 1.2 driven 1m. Both might be disaligned after strong winds so that's not the point. A motor solution is not only cheaper but as the shop vendor told you more flexible. This way you would also be able to get much more satellites than with the fixed T90. Just for the case you might have also interest in 7W and 42E, 1m is just below the limit on some weaker frequencies. If these positions might be in future interest, i would take a 1.15m. Diseqc 1.2 motors are designed for up to 1m dishes but not few people run even 1.25m Gibertinis on them. There is a user in windy northern Germany that also runs an Emme Esse 1.15m on a Moteck SG2100A without any problems for about 2 years now as far as i remember. If you are not interested in the weaker 7W/42E as well, 1m is an excellent size for Basel to get most of the satellites.

Bulsatcom would only change the satellite if it would like to have a better coverage of eastern Ukraine and western Russia, northern Scandinavia as well. Hellas Sat 2 is a cheap bird, covers major parts of Europe with high signal level and is rather high on the horizon except of Ireland. It's rather difficult to find another satellite that gathers all these factors. The russian 53E could cover better the East but would cause lower elevation in western Europe. 45E might be more expensive. West of 39E i believe that the rent of a transponder is more expensive. An option would be 1W (very low signal in the iberian peninsula) or 5E if with the new upcoming satellites Thor 5 and Sirius 4 are enough capacities free. As you can see a prediction is almost impossible. A change is not beeing done every day but it could cause a completely new installation of the T90 if you decide to take this.

Greetings also to you. Have an excellent weekend.

 

[wod]

pipiasisi, going for the 1m dish and motor will be a good choice if you want to view more satellites and don't mind waiting a few seconds for the dish to move.

if you can have larger a 1.2m dish will be better but then you will need to use the gibertini polar mount on the 1.2m dish and a 36volt motor and control that by a vbox linked to your satellite receiver

 

[pipiasisi]

Good Afternoon Stuttgart,
thanks for your email. I now think that I will buy a normal dish with a motor. With the size I will stick to 1m because 1.15m is pushing it. Will need to measure again. How much will the dish turn from 13E to 39E? I was thinkink of placing the dish on the left side (west) of the balcony.
How long will I need to wait if I watch a channel on 13E and then change channel to 39E? Do I need to make a coffee break until the dish has turned?

I will be so reliefed when I have set up the dish on the balcony and all the Satellites will work that I want.

@wod; thank you for your comment. like i said, I will measure the balcony again and I will see what dish size I can have.

Going now to the shops.

See you later.

 

[wod]

depending on your due south satellite found out by your location longitude and latitude you align the dish on that and then see how far each side you can get and then move the dish if needed about on the balcony

the dish won't take to long to move 13-39e.

a 36volt motor with the polar mount on the 1metre dish will be quicker but it will cost abit more

 

[deepbluesky]

Diseqc 1.2 motors usually run on 2-2.5s/°, so it will take about 13-16s to turn from 13E to 39E. Count also 1-2s for opening encrypted channels and it will be roundabout 20s in worst case.

 

[pipiasisi]

Good Morning all!
Thanks for your posts.
I am now 99% sure that I will go for the 1m dish. This will be my first Satellite dish and I will see how it will be with changing the channels. In the worst case when it really takes too long to see the other channel, then I can always buy a T90. This will be my first encounter with a dish and receiver. I will see how I will go. Hope not to have any problems and not to be disappointed.

I will keep you posted......

 

[pipiasisi]

Good Evening All,
I have finally bought my first Satellite Dish. It is a 1 m Gibertini Dish, DiseqC 1.2 SG-2100 Motor and a Streambox DVB 50.
I have installed it today. We had a Sunny day.
I have noticed, that when I turn on the Receiver, the Dish goes 50 degress West. I was then able to turn the Dish to Hotbird 13.0E. I was able to see the channels. Then I chose the Astra 23.5E and the Dish again turned West instead of going East!

Why is this happening? What shall I do, to solve this problem? What I am doing wrong?

 

[pipiasisi]

Good Evening All,
I have finally bought my first Satellite Dish. It is a 1 m Gibertini Dish, DiseqC 1.2 SG-2100 Motor and a Streambox DVB 50.
I have installed it today. We had a Sunny day.
I have noticed, that when I turn on the Receiver, the Dish goes 50 degress West. I was then able to turn the Dish to Hotbird 13.0E. I was able to see the channels. Then I chose the Astra 23.5E and the Dish again turned West instead of going East!

Why is this happening? What shall I do, to solve this problem? What I am doing wrong?

I was able to solve the Problem.
All I have to do now is to adjust the Dish and Motor to the right angle.

Wishing all a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year 2008!