He Can't Be Serious!

[TJExcalibur]

I was getting out of the car yesterday and a man asked me what size dish I had as he could see if from the road, even though its at the back of the house. 90cm I told him and then he said. I hope its earth bonded. Only through the coax I said jokingly. No way he said, asking for trouble and your insurance won't pay out if you get a strike. Metal dish eh? Best to bond the dish to the pole and then run an earth cable of approved size to your earth bonding by your consumer unit. But that's at the front of the house I said, hell of a job. I know what I am on about he said. I'm NICEIC qualified you know. Now the Overseer here is rabbiting on about it. Problem is he has just moved in around the corner.

 

[Lazarus]

Well if he really is NICEIC approved, he shouldn't be using misleading and incorrect terminology like "Earth Bonding".
Earthing and (Equipotential) Bonding, although having some similar features, are separate activities intended to mitigate two different types of risk.

Sadly, the term has crept into everyday misuse, both within and without the trade and, although there's not much that can be done about the latter, when I did ECA assessments I insisted applicants demonstrated proper understanding.

Indeed NICEIC have their own Guidance documentation on the topic. Maybe he should read it?

And, of course, Lightning Protection is yet another strand.

 

[Lazarus]

By the way, he has no Statutory Authority, so you can safely (!) ignore him.

 

[jeallen01]

Personally, I wouldn't connect a cable to the consumer unit as, as you say, that's a long run - and if there is a strike then the cable could vapourise and "set fire" to something.

However, I might be inclined to run a bonding cable from the dish mount to an earthing rod adjacent to the house so that any strike goes straight to "true ground" - which is what the strike is looking for anyway!

My TD110 is on a steel scaffolding pole in concrete which extends below the soil level, and so I think that should be reasonably OK - OTOH, the other dishes are not, and I have sometimes thought I should install an earthing rod near them and run decent-sized cables to each dish. Then again, I've lived here for 40+ yrs and (AFAIK) we've never had a strike anywhere near here (lot's of large steel-framed buildings in the general area, and I suspect they would be much more "attractive targets" for lightning strikes!)

 

[TJExcalibur]

Personally, I wouldn't connect a cable to the consumer unit as, as you say, that's a long run - and if there is a strike then the cable could vapourise and "set fire" to something.

However, I might be inclined to run a bonding cable from the dish mount to an earthing rod adjacent to the house so that any strike goes straight to "true ground" - which is what the strike is looking for anyway!

My TD110 is on a steel scaffolding pole in concrete which extends below the soil level, and so I think that should be reasonably OK - OTOH, the other dishes are not, and I have sometimes thought I should install an earthing rod near them and run decent-sized cables to each dish. Then again, I've lived here for 40+ yrs and (AFAIK) we've never had a strike anywhere near here (lot's of large steel-framed buildings in the general area, and I suspect they would be much more "attractive targets" for lightning strikes!)

Now I can manage that, bit fiddly but not to bad in the summer. Look better if i could run a copper earth without any plastic coating as that green and yellow stuff stands out.

 

[jeallen01]

Now I can manage that, bit fiddly but not to bad in the summer. Look better if i could run a copper earth without any plastic coating as that green and yellow stuff stands out.

Check with your nearest electrical wholesaler - I suspect they would carry/can get stuff, and the rod and connecting clamps as well (and, if you are going to do this, then get some really large cross-sectional area stuff as lightning strikes are 1,000's of Amps!) OTOH, even a "token" rod and simple cable might be enough to "satisfy" the Overseer if you consider the possibility of actual strikes is indeed very low .

 

[Channel Hopper]

I was getting out of the car yesterday and a man asked me what size dish I had as he could see if from the road, even though its at the back of the house. 90cm I told him and then he said. I hope its earth bonded. Only through the coax I said jokingly. No way he said, asking for trouble and your insurance won't pay out if you get a strike. Metal dish eh? Best to bond the dish to the pole and then run an earth cable of approved size to your earth bonding by your consumer unit. But that's at the front of the house I said, hell of a job. I know what I am on about he said. I'm NICEIC qualified you know. Now the Overseer here is rabbiting on about it. Problem is he has just moved in around the corner.

Is his house within trebuchet distance ? Perhaps he should consider getting protection as well.

 

[Terryl]

Earth bonding any antenna system directly to the Earth it's self is the best way, helps keep that nasty lighting out of the house.

And with multiple dishes (or other antennas) a single bonding point would be the best way, run a #12 or #10 copper wire to each antenna/dish then directly to one main down lead, this down lead should be the next size up for the best performance. (if all bonding wires are #12 the use a #10 for the main)

 

[Huevos]

If you want to earth a dish against lightning strike just stick a stake in the ground. There is no connection between the dish and the coax. Dish is isolated by the lnb plastic body cover and LNB collar. Even if you do bond the LNB/coax straight down to ground it is still going to blow anything that is near it, STB, TV, etc.

 

[Terryl]

And he dose not know what he is talking about...Bond the dish to the pole????? The dish is mounted to the pole with some sort of metal clamping mount, this would bond it directly to the pole.

You bond the dish to ground not the mast, the mast can be the next thing in-line but the dish should be first.

 

[Terryl]

Lightning travels several thousands of feet to what ever it's looking to hit, a small piece of plastic will not stop it, the only way to protect the center conductor on the coax is to use a gas discharge device in-line before it goes inside the house.

A coax ground block only grounds the coax shield, it does not protect the center conductor.

 

[jeallen01]

Earth bonding any antenna system directly to the Earth it's self is the best way, helps keep that nasty lighting out of the house...

Basically what I said in my 1st post!!

And he dose not know what he is talking about...Bond the dish to the pole????? The dish is mounted to the pole with some sort of metal clamping mount, this would bond it directly to the pole.
You bond the dish to ground not the mast, the mast can be the next thing in-line but the dish should be first.

Agreed.

OTOH, this a "horses for courses" situation - Where Terryl lives, there is a very high chance of lightning strikes, whereas, at least in Southern England, there is a very, very low chance of more than one or two a year spread over a wide area, and those will generally hit tall and large buildings. That's why lightning protection is generally required on such buildings in the UK - whereas that is a very rare requirement for residential buildings. However were it an almost "mandatory" requirement then Sky TV installers (won't call them "engineers"!) would have to make sure every house to which they fitted a dish already had lightning protection in place (or else Sky would be facing huge consumer litigation for "damage" to many of the thousands of properties to which dishes have been fitted !) - and they don't!

 

[jeallen01]

Lightning travels several thousands of feet to what ever it's looking to hit, a small piece of plastic will not stop it, the only way to protect the center conductor on the coax is to use a gas discharge device in-line before it goes inside the house.

A coax ground block only grounds the coax shield, it does not protect the center conductor.

Again I agree with both of those points - the strike voltages (possibly around a Megavolt, or a lot more) will break down any normal cable (etc.) insulation, and the resulting currents (1000's of Amps) will then fuse "everything" together or simply vapourise it.

OTOH, high capacity gas discharge devices (usually called "Gas Discharge Tubes" or "GDT"s) are quite difficult to find (at least by most "non-industrial" people in this country!) and are pretty expensive when you do (almost "been there, done that").

So, keeping the KISS principle in mind, if the OP (or at least the "Overseer"!) really considers (which I don't) that his dish must have lightning protection, then simply grounding the dish directly to the soil directly below it should almost certainly be "more than adequate" (if not overkill!).

 

[TJExcalibur]

Again I agree with both of those points - the strike voltages (possibly around a Megavolt, or a lot more) will break down any normal cable (etc.) insulation, and the resulting currents (1000's of Amps) will then fuse "everything" together.

OTOH, high capacity gas discharge devices (usually called "Gas Discharge Tubes" of "GDT"s) are quite difficult to find (at least by most "non-industrial" people in this country!) and are pretty expensive when you do (almost "been there, done that").

So, keeping the KISS principle in mind, if the OP (or at least the "Overseer"!) really considers (which I don't) that his dish must have lightning protection, then simply grounding the dish directly to the soil directly below it should almost certainly be "more than adequate" (if not overkill!).

The Overseer was only worried about the insurance being invalid but I think its OK. I do not see how they would be able to dispute a claim saying the damage would not have happened if an earth had been fitted. But I will check the policy and ask the insurance company, of course not mentioning my details.

 

[Terryl]

I dont know about suppliers of on that side of the pond but here stateside I use these hummers.

https://www.amazon.com/WILSON-ELECTRONICS-Lightning-Surge-Protector/dp/B007CNL35E

At 54 USD you can't go wrong.

And those little power strips that say they are surge protectors don't be-leave it, all they are is an MOV across the main, wont stop much.

One other form of protection for the inside stuff is to use a UPS system rated for lightning protection, stuff from Triplite (and others) has attached equipment insurance to help you get new stuff if the lightning gets through their stuff.

It also lets you watch TV if the power goes out, or protect that recording of your favorite show if the power bumps and goes out.

I use several UPS sytems with extended battery packs, the bigger the system (wattage wise) the longer you can watch TV, my main entetainment system has about 3 days of backup power as the power goes on and off around here all the time, one time a few years ago it was out for 4 days, I went on generator power, but that is costly fuel wise.

 

[jeallen01]

@Terryl
As I said, it's a "horses for courses" situation - but you are in the US and "we" are mainly in the UK. You are right about "surge-protection" MOVs (but they are OK'ish" when on the internal side of the house distribution panel consumer units and socket-outlets/receptacles, which are designed to limit the internal voltages to 6kV per IEC "Class III" voltage limits),

You could be correct about the need for UPSs in some areas of the UK fed by Low voltage (i.e. <600V) overhead power distribution cables - but most residential properties in heavily populated areas in the UK have underground power distribution systems, and then there is the "National Grid" which means that the Very High Voltage supplies come from a nationally interconnected system where a 2nd supply kicks in if the 1st "dies". I've lived in this house for over 40 yrs and the number of power-outages in that time has probably been less than the number of fingers on 2 hands!

 

[Huevos]

@Terryl I am saying earth the dish direct to ground.

Anyway a wall mounted dish is very unlikely to take a lightning strike when you have a TV aerial towering above the house.

 

[Channel Hopper]

The Overseer was only worried about the insurance being invalid but I think its OK. I do not see how they would be able to dispute a claim saying the damage would not have happened if an earth had been fitted. But I will check the policy and ask the insurance company, of course not mentioning my details.

Please dont't waste oxygen doing so. Lighting could strike a satellite dish/TV aerial, house next door/down the road and still take out your kit.

Thank your new neighbour next time, since you are certain a large prick living nearby has improved the odds against a direct strike.

 

[jeallen01]

Please dont't waste oxygen doing so. Lighting could strike a satellite dish/TV aerial, house next door/down the road and still take out your kit.

Thank your new neighbour next time, since you are certain a large prick living nearby has improved the odds against a direct strike.

Quite SO - I think this house is one of the few in the area that doesn't have a DTT antenna on the roof (UGLY! - ours is in the Attic!)
@ TJExcalibur
Seems you ought to try to persuade the "Overseer" that the "effort" is not worth the reward - show her this thread, and she "might" be "persuaded" about that, and let the "other guy" take the heat when sh1t happens if it ever should (which I very much doubt!).

 

[skomedal]

show her this thread, and she "might" be ).

#1
I was getting out of the car yesterday and a man asked me what size dish I had as he could see if from the road, even though its at the back of the house. 90cm I told him and then he said. I hope its earth bonded.




EDIT gender to red