2 house private setup (noob)

[timo_w2s]

I should add that I'm still a little sceptical that the SD box swap is actually happening in any meaningful way. Apart from a few brief posts on forums like this I've not heard or seen any links to anything official about the expiry of SD boxes.

 

[Huevos]

I thought maybe they'll just switch off the SD EPG data (and use a new system for the HD boxes, if they aren't already). After all, it wouldn't be needed if everyone was using an HD box and would render the SD boxes useless...

My point was, if this HD box swap out is going ahead and an HD box with the new software (not HD subscription) is required to decrypt the SD channels too then there will be no Sky SD box users out there for Sky to care about.

All boxes use the same EPG data, i.e. there's only one data set. The only difference between HD and SD boxes is the way the GUI renders it once it's downloaded.

 

[timo_w2s]

All boxes use the same EPG data, i.e. there's only one data set. The only difference between HD and SD boxes is the way the GUI renders it once it's downloaded.

But for how long, if Sky want to get rid of SD boxes in the long term? :-rub

 

[A nonymous]

As i said certain info is easy enough to get hold of if you ask and if you get info sent out to you if you are a trade customer of certain companies. If you look at the attachment you can see what Sky are up to to get people to start swapping out their old boxes.

There is talk among the trade of what is going to happen plus what i have heard from people i know who work for Sky.



At the end of the day the only people who know for certain what is going to happen is Sky themselves, but there has been a a lot of talk regarding a swap out of equipment starting this year. I would say this sweetener is just to get the proverbial ball rolling.

 

[Lazarus]

Sounds unduly complex - that Memo is as clear as mud.

Glad I'm not beholden to them!

 

[Huevos]

If you look at the attachment you can see what Sky are up to to get people to start swapping out their old boxes.

To me it looks like something they are doing to people who already have HD boxes but don't have an HD subscription. Just a trick with the channel numbering. Key in '401' and you have a super sharp picture of Sky Sports 1 HD. Couple of months later the picture is all soft because your free trail has run out and '401' diverts to Sky Sports 1 SD.

 

[Solar Flare]

Yes Huevos i do have personal experience with a card that has been paired with the new pairing method. Certain HD channels are no longer working, meaning they are under the new boxkey pairing sequence.

Certain HD channels are included under the new pairing sequence, along with the Movies and Sports in both SD and HD.

If they are going to the trouble of swapping out all the older boxes, I think there stands a very good chance that once the swap out is complete they will put all the channels under the pairing system in the same way that Total TV & Dolce did a few years ago. That is just my personal thoughts and not a concrete fact.

What's so tight about the new pairing that a linux box can't emulate? I confess to having zero knowledge on the matter, but it seems to me that unless there is a human being from Sky in your living room, there should be a way to get a linux box to masquerade as something else? Especially since the Sky HD box has been out for a long while now?

 

[smoggy07]

I will only accept a new box from them if it comes with no strings attached. I will then cancel it and sell the box on ebay.

I would much rather use my VM Cable Tivo box than any offering that Sky could give me.

Nano

I bet they`ll have a new 12 or 18 month contract in the small print somewhere

I can`t get enough of my VM Tivo, I`m thinking about another for the bedroom.

Strangely I don`t feel robbed paying Mr B the £5 per month (per box) Tivo fee, as apposed to Mr M`s recording tax, the Tivo is miles more value for money.

Regarding the new pairing/upgrade, I think this may be relevant:

We will need to carry out an update to your Sky service in the near future. The information we need about your box will allow us to ensure you continue to receive all the services you've subscribed to. Without this information you may be unable to receive some of your channels after the update.

Source: hxxp://www.skyviewinghelp.com/

 

[davemurgtroyd]

With regard to the swap out of old boxes the whole problem is down to the current software on the Thomson and all SD boxes is by OpenTV. The contract with OpenTV via NDS has been cancelled and at present Sky are paying a licence fee to OpenTV to continue using the software for mainly encryption purposes but they will not have the rights to modify that software for the next version of the NDS encryption software which will then only run on the latest Darwin/Picasso software which is only on the latest non Thomson HD+ and non PVR HD boxes.

It is assumed that when the encryption changes that all SD and Thomson HD+ boxes will only then work as FTA recievers - not even as FreesatFromSky or PVR boxes.

One of the changes on the current encryption that appears to be happening is that cards will not only be linked to the serial number of the box but also the unique Receiver ID number (now visible in System Details) which appears to be a measure to stop cards working in non Sky receivers and cut back on card sharing.

 

[timo_w2s]

Thanks, do we have a timeframe for when the SD & Thomson HD+ boxes will no longer work with a Sky card?

 

[A nonymous]

Only Sky know that one, but i have seen Autumn 2013 been thrown around on some other forums, but as for the accuracy of that, its anybodies guess.

Nano

 

[PaulR]

If legacy boxes do revert to FTA receivers (at best!), presumably this means no more EPG and only now-and-then information?

 

[timo_w2s]

If legacy boxes do revert to FTA receivers (at best!), presumably this means no more EPG and only now-and-then information?

If there is no EPG then the old boxes won't be able to load the channel list. Let's hope Sky don't put the full EPG on a DVB-S2 transponder...

 

[davemurgtroyd]

If legacy boxes do revert to FTA receivers (at best!), presumably this means no more EPG and only now-and-then information?

Why do you think that? The EPG has nothing whatsoever to do with encryption. There is only one EPG data stream which the box software interprets in its own way to present the GUI. Why would they change the EPG data stream? Again why would they move it to a DVB S2 transponder any time soon? Its present format and transponder location work perfectly well for all types of Sky box.

 

[timo_w2s]

Why do you think that? The EPG has nothing whatsoever to do with encryption. There is only one EPG data stream which the box software interprets in its own way to present the GUI. Why would they change the EPG data stream? Again why would they move it to a DVB S2 transponder any time soon? Its present format and transponder location work perfectly well for all types of Sky box.

Presumably if everyone has an HD MPEG4 compatible Sky box then eventually all encrypted channels will move over to the more efficient DVB-S2 standard with MPEG4 encoding, even for SD channels. Sky (and other uplinkers) could then squeeze more channels into each transponder and close some transponders that will no longer be needed. So then it becomes a question of why keep an inefficient DVB-S running just to please a few FTA customers who want the EPG data for their outdated boxes.

The only DVB-S MPEG2 channels that will need to keep running for compatibility with older Freesat boxes are the SD versions of any Freesat channels and any encrypted channels that share a transponder with a FTA Freesat channel. I suppose these will eventually close too as everyone moves over to Freesat HD boxes.

I'm not suggesting this will happen any time very soon but I'm sure it'll be the long term plan for most broadcasters.

 

[PaulR]

davemurgtroyd, on 15 May 2013 - 12:16 PM, said:
Why do you think that? The EPG has nothing whatsoever to do with encryption.

I know that but the EPG software runs on top of the OpenTV software so its absence may cause the EPG to indirectly not be used.