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Analoguesat

Analoguesat

Administrator
Staff member
My Satellite Setup
TM 5402HD
Sky+ UK.
My Location
Scottish Borders
6 extra steams have appeared - no doubt for the summer events

Frequency details:
12422H
27500 2/3

SD:
tagged as 6802 - 6806

HD:
tagged as 6811
 
UK spot beam ? Not very strong here but I guess good margins with the FEC 2/3 and DVB-S (QPSK).
 
could this be 2F spot ? I don't get any signal on this transponder. Except for about 30 minutes during noon. I've managed to track the signal wobble and it more or less matched the one 10964H does. Just much much weaker. I will try to verify that tomorrow.

Given the higher frequency i would expect that the null is further to the west (so here :( ).

People in the sidelobes seem to have no problems with getting a lock.

Imho that means that it cannot be a PE transponder as some people report. Anyways, why should they put RB channels on a PE transponder ?
 
From the signal level of 12422H here in the UK it looks more like a UK spot beam to me too, it's almost 5-10% stranger than European beams in this band.

This is very interesting and I think this is the first case of a higher frequency using a spot beam that I can remember (other than possible tests at 43.5E) and so this suggests that spot beams are indeed possible pretty much anywhere. :eek: Uh oh...
 
This evening no sign whatsoever of any 12422H (like 2F uk. 2E uk ok). Will test when 2F uk works here (late night\daytime) and see if it appears.
 
Got them! Quite low signal. Came within reception levels same time as for ex. ch5 on 10964H.
 

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NO Singnal here in Istanbul. It is not possible that TP is on European beame. It must be on UK spot beam
 
I think this pretty much confirms our suspicions that it is 2F UK.
 
They show the weakest Q levels of anything I can get off 28°E. Were they not FEC 2/3 I guess there would only be a black screen here with the current dish.
 
Lyngsat list is at Europe Ku which must be wrong. It's approximaly 1.5 dB weaker than 10964 but still no problem to catch 24/7. FEC 2/3 gives 2 dB margin compared to FEC 5/6.

screenshot006.webp
 
Here in the UK 10964H and 12422H are the same strength on my 60cm setup at 90% quality. Only 11127V is more powerful at 92%. The rest of 2F UK are between 86-90%. Interestingly all 2E UK is slightly weaker at 84-87% across the range. 2E and 2F Europe are between 80-86% and Eutelsat 28A is lagging behind at 60-77% but I can't remember if I aligned more on 28.2E when I set it up years ago but until the recent problems it was a more reasonable 70-77%.

So going by signal quality levels only I've usually got a pretty good idea where a transmission is coming from except if it's on 2F Europe or 2E Europe beam as they are virtually indistinguishable from each other. It'll be interesting to see how 2G compares.
 
no doubt this new SES surprise is on 2F UK spot. It is about 10dB weaker than the 2F PE transponders with 33MHz bandwidth. Thanks to the robust QPSK 2/3 modulation reception is possible here with 240cm, however no rain reserve whatsover in the evening...
 
I forgot that my LNB is modified, so the noise figure is optimized for lower 10.7 GHz compared to 12.4 GHz. This can explain the difference. But also since I'm on the sidelobe , this can also affect the strength..Last year when the tranmission was on 11.4 GHz something it was very strong...
 
Breaking up here now, exactly shadowing the usual evening signal loss on 2F uk spot.
 
Im sure one of the early technical specs for 2E / 2F said something along the lines that the any frequency could be switched to either beam
 
Deffo astra 2F uk spot, had astra 2E bbc channels today tried the red button TP no lock despite the lower fec.

As previously stated hit and miss on astra 2E uk spot when wobble permits, not a sniff of channels/TPs on astra 2F uk spot as usual.

Regards
 
bema said:
Lyngsat list is at Europe Ku which must be wrong. It's approximaly 1.5 dB weaker than 10964 but still no problem to catch 24/7. FEC 2/3 gives 2 dB margin compared to FEC 5/6.

View attachment 78807
Click to expand...

I have told flysat it is the UK beam hopefully they will respond soon.
 
Analoguesat said:
Im sure one of the early technical specs for 2E / 2F said something along the lines that the any frequency could be switched to either beam
Click to expand...
Yep, they did say that, I just think after so long having all the UK spots grouped together in the lower band some people started to question if the satellites where really quite as flexible as they originally made out.

Now I don't want to go putting ideas in anyone's heads but as the UK spots are stronger than Europe beams wouldn't it make sense to switch some more over and reduce the FEC even more? Perhaps the Sky HD ones that need more signal? I suppose the question is will the loss of some unofficial subs in Europe offset the cost savings of a reduced number of transponders. Now Astra 2G's Europe beam isn't centred on the UK and I still think it won't be used as much as the UK spot, could this be a hint of what is to come?
 

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cazhh said:
Given the higher frequency i would expect that the null is further to the west (so here :( ).
Click to expand...

Would think there would be some winners as well as losers, but everyone posting here is reporting lower signal (including me)
 
Very interesting that this is using the UK spot, so now the mystery of whether the upper bands (F for sure, probably E and G included) can do UK spot, it leaves the door open for Channel 4 to potentially switch TP40 to the UK spotbeam, amongst other broadcasters too.

To elaborate and agree with what Timo has mentioned a couple of posts above; whilst Sky have a vested interest in their European subscribers, Viacom, Discovery and UKTV, irrespective of their channels being encrypted, could benefit from extra bandwidth, in C4's case allowing the FTV encryption removal from C4 Ireland and 4Music. Viacom could, for example, gain another 10.5mb netto bandwidth on their 2E E band TP just by changing the FEC to 7/8 going UK spot - would give them an option for Channel 5 HD.

I'll be very curious to know what the uplink operators will do with the higher power ex EB1 C-band TP's once they go over to 2E/F/G as higher power will allow relaxation of FEC too.
 
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