Help needed in identifying certain transponders (new, cryogenic LNB cooling)

BombedOne

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Hello everyone, long time no post here :)

Since I can't get any dish larger than 1.5 meters for reasonable price, I decided to squeeze out maximum from my system, and built a cryogenic LNB cooling system. It consists of series of peltier modules and brings LNB main body temperature to whopping -60C ! (photos will come later)

The problem is, I'm very very busy, so had only about 15 minutes to test it today (and won't have any time maybe a month or so). I've captured several strange transponders in Ku band, for which I was not able to determine to which satellite they belong, only suspect one to belong to 74E. Here they are (they are all in range of 100E-70E)

11057 mhz, SR 26468, Pol. H
11093 mhz, SR 26468, Pol. H
11484 mhz, SR 24997, Pol. H
11513 mhz, SR 3499, Pol H (This latest one looks like it may be ORSAC channel from 74E, but lyngsat says SR 3000 for that channel, not 3499 as I captured)

Awaiting for your ideas, thanks in advance!
 

hvdh

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Well your first 3 transponders are from Yamal 201 at 90 East, and you're well within the footprint!
 

Vipersan

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I for one am waiting with bated breath for pictures of the cooling module...
If memory serves ...one of my inspirational heroes ..Klaus Shumacher...r.i.p...
did something very similar when he pulled astra 19 east (analogue) in south America..
rgds
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Channel Hopper

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BombedOne said:
Hello everyone, long time no post here :)

Since I can't get any dish larger than 1.5 meters for reasonable price, I decided to squeeze out maximum from my system, and built a cryogenic LNB cooling system. It consists of series of peltier modules and brings LNB main body temperature to whopping -60C ! (photos will come later)

Done that , been there.

It does help when the ideal dish is unavailable or not allowed, and will help lock the 2% of channels outside reality, but not much more.

Improving LNB noise is the last in the chain. it costs far more than growing a few % on the dish size, so prepare to be disappointed when you don't get the results.
 

BombedOne

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Thanks.

I know that LNB cooling is not the best way, but I would disagree that it is more expensive than larger dish.

Now I have 1.5 meter primefocus dish. If upgrading, should get at least 2.4 meter one. For the 2.4 meter one, I have the following choices:

1. Prodelin 1251, 1700 euro+feedhorn. Need to pre-order, delivery time 2 months.
2. Laser Sat from Turkey, about 900$, delivery, import duties and so on will rise price up to 1500$, need to import by myself
3. Some bulgarian manufacturer, price about 1100$, import duties and delivery and so on - up to 2000$

In comparison, that cooling system costed me less than 200$. It consists of several peltier modules chained together, and huge cpu heatsink with fan. Inverto C120 LNB being cooled, and whole assembly is encased in foam, to prevent condensation and from outside, mylar reflective foil is added. Needs about 20 minutes to reach -60C
 

Captain Jack

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Interesting. Pictures please :D

Also, wouldn't such low temps destroy the LNB?
 

BombedOne

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It will destroy, and I've already killed several of them, if temperature is rapidly decreased/increased (I've poured liquid nitrogen, and after opening dead lnb, found all parts unsoldered). This system has quite large intertia, so it cools down/warms up gradually. The another problem is that feedhorn, while being mounted through teflon insulator, still cools down enough to form an ice on it and in it, which is very bad, so I have to mount a heater on feedhorn.

P.S. I flew abroad this morning, so do not except photos in this week at least.
 

mouse3

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Cooling LNC to -50C signal level increase by 1,6dB,tested myself on 2,2m dish hunting Astra 1N here in Transilvania.
From 47dB to 48,6dB on signal meter,conclusion 2,2m not enough for reception'O'-red...inverto black ultra twin chinese stuff perform better vs. Invacom,LOL:D... it s summer and signal it s very low.Make test one months ago.
Next experiment,Ku band array.Array and cooling must catch this impossible bird on summer time.:-worship

Here are the picture about.Enjoy.

Some explanations,2mm coper pipes i use to spray dry nitrogenne to remove moisture and air from LNC probes,some low tech antifreeze device.Works perfect and do the job,no ice and moisture present after experiment inside LNC probes.
Test take only 60 seconds,enough for conclusion.Cooling refrigerant R404a.5Kg.

Who want to go more advance,R 1150 cooling temperature -80C,but can t be found here this refrigerant.I need help from UK to have it.Combined with R404a in two stage refrigeration unit means -105C temperature for LNC.
Enough for crazy Dx-ing i think.
 

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A 1.6dB increase in useable signal does not equate to an increase of dish size from 1.5 to 2.4m

But I am interested in the 'desoldering' you have achieved.
 

BombedOne

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As far as I know, linear increase of dish size does not linearly increases the gain. For example, difference between 60cm and 120cm dish gain is more, then 120cm vs 240cm. As dish size goes higher, effective illumination area decreases.
 

Channel Hopper

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An increase of twice the dish surface area is (more or less) constant to a doubling of the gain (add 3 d:cool:, the 1.5m if doubled would be a dish of around 2.13m.

There will be some variation between different dish designs, feed illumination/efficiency and other parameters such as elevation angle, but the formula is more or less constant.
 

BombedOne

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Give it another try today. Found another sat, with a lot of transponders, but only two were lockable:

11563 SR 13998
11625 SR 5425

There were also bumps on spectrum analyzer around 11080, 11130, but receiver can not have lock.

[edit] Found, this is Intelsat 15 @ 85.2E, just lyngsat has no proper frequencies entered, used flysat instead.

Not writing polarisation, since LNB has protective collar, so I can't see it's orientation. I guess this is vertical polarisation.

So far, I managed to break one of connectors, so cooling system ceased working. I'll took it to repair tomorrow, so you'll have the photos of it's internals.
 
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