Lost some sats, and very confused....

[cokeaddict]

Ok guys,

I am very very confused at the moment.

I am currently using a Motec 2100 motor and a Traix TD110 (1.1m dish).

I have had this setup for around 4/5 years now with 0 issue's.

Until last weekend, I could pickup pretty much every sat from 53° to 58°w with the only exceptions being 26°e and any others that have no beam anywhere near the uk.

Anyhow since last weekend, I have been unable to get a signal from 16°e, 21.6°e, 23.5°e, 28.2°e, 33°e, and 39°e.

So I went out and had a look at my dish, it appears to have somehow picked up a small dent in the top of the dish face (at the 1 o'clock position) and looks like something has hit the back of it, all very strange as the dish is above the guttering to look over the roof so I can get it round to the west sats.

Today I figured i'd best get the ladder out and go see whats going on.

At roof height the dent is pretty much un-noticable, can see it better from the ground as the light catch's it.

Anyway I set about checking the alignment, but still had reasonable signal on 1°w which is where it was aligned to (btv-1 80% signal.

I spent a few hours getting it setup on 1°w to get max signal from it (84%), and checked a few sats to make sure it's tracking the arc fine, and all seemed well.

Except that I still can't get a signal on 16°e, 21.6°e, 23.5°e, 28.2°e, 33°e, and 39°e.

19°e seems to have lost about 50% signal (can't get a lock on any HD channels) and 13°e has lost around 30% signal (this is the same as it was before adjusting the dish today).

All other sats come in fine with good strong signals, and i've checked this on my VU+ duo and my old DM800 HD and both giving the same issue's on the same channels / sats.

The only thing I can think of, is that around 20m infront of the dish are some large tree's, and they could be blocking the signal (although they never have in the last 5 years), but if it was that, can the signals on the above sats just vanish overnight due to tree's ??

It's all very odd, as like I say I am in the UK, can't get 28.2°e which has to be 1 of the strongest sats here, yet I can get 7°w which has to be 1 of the weakest lol.

Anyone have any idea's what the hell is going on with my setup ?

 

[Mickha]

Try checking the signal quality as you move east, start with 5E, then 7E, 9E, 10E, 13E, and 19E, check if the signal quality drops off.
It sounds more like your dish has been knocked off the arc and needs re-aligning. Are you using Usals or Diseqc to drive the motor?

 

[cokeaddict]

Try checking the signal quality as you move east, start with 5E, then 7E, 9E, 10E, 13E, and 19E, check if the signal quality drops off.
It sounds more like your dish has been knocked off the arc and needs re-aligning. Are you using Usals or Diseqc to drive the motor?

Signal quality is fine, right now on 13°e (can't move the dish at the moment as it is recording a program), I have 84% signal and 83% quality (well AGC).

I have tried Usals and Diseqc both give same results.

As for the dish needing to be realigned, I have been out there most of the afternoon, and I can not get it any better than it is, I have tried everything I can think of, even trying to align the motor on 19°e and again trying on 28.2°e forgetting every other sat, and it just won't get a decent signal on 19e and nothing at all on 28.2e.

 

[Lazarus]

Have you checked the connection at the motor end of the LNB spur cable?

Repeated panning of the motor can cause this to come loose and it won't retighten fully as you pan back - a bit like trying to push string.

This can lead to intermittent then permanent disconnection of the LNB over part of the arc.

Best solution, if this is what has happened, is to alter the fulcrum from the connection itself to a point a few inches along the cable, by tying the cable to the mount.

 

[cokeaddict]

Have you checked the connection at the motor end of the LNB spur cable?

Repeated panning of the motor can cause this to come loose and it won't retighten fully as you pan back - a bit like trying to push string.

This can lead to intermittent then permanent disconnection of the LNB over part of the arc.

Best solution, if this is what has happened, is to alter the fulcrum from the connection itself to a point a few inches along the cable, by tying the cable to the mount.

Yeh I did check all connections when I was up there, infact I removed all leads, removed the connectors to make sure the cable was still clean (no water has been in the connections), and rejoined them, and it hasn't made any difference.

 

[Lazarus]

Ok, fair enough.

The only other things that spring to mind are:

1. Have you reset the Motor? If not it may be worth a try - but don't forget to send it to Thor first as when you stick an unbent paperclip in the reset hole, the dish will move.

2. If using T & K brackets, check the mount is still plumb (Well whatever mount you are using, check it!). If something did hit the dish, the impulse may have caused the entire dish/motor/pole to slip forward, for example, if the brackets have elongated holes.

 

[cokeaddict]

Ok, fair enough.

The only other things that spring to mind are:

1. Have you reset the Motor? If not it may be worth a try - but don't forget to send it to Thor first as when you stick an unbent paperclip in the reset hole, the dish will move.

2. If using T & K brackets, check the mount is still plumb (Well whatever mount you are using, check it!). If something did hit the dish, the impulse may have caused the entire dish/motor/pole to slip forward, for example, if the brackets have elongated holes.

Yeh I have done both of those too (sorry should have said in the opening post).

I have also forgot to mention I have a fair amount of play in my motor, side to side (east/west) it's rock solid, but it has around 5mm of up and downwards movement in the arm. To counter act that, I have moved the motor elevation up, and then yanked the dish down, so that the final elevation is where it should be (as the weight of the dish will keep the arm down), and it's been working 100% like this for atleast 12 months (last time I went up the ladder, was to adjust elevation so I could get 39°e as this was missing from the arc originally, just needed to be elevated on the motor that time by around 0.5mm).

I have also tried moving the pole backwards and forwards, and leaning on it to flex it east / west a little and it didn't change anyting by more than around 3% signal on the sats I can already get.

 

[satelliteman]

Check

> dish hasn't moved on the motor shaft.
> motor inclination is spot on.

Some of those birds mentioned are pretty strong, so something major must be at fault. Maybe a picture of your set up will help.

 

[Huevos]

Can you take the motor out of the equation. Mount the dish directly on your mast and see if you can get 28ºE. If not it could be down to the tree being a fraction taller than last year and now it's got some leaves it is blocking the signal. If the tree is 20 metres away like you said it would need to be 10 metres higher than the dish (on 28ºE) to cause a problem.

 

[cokeaddict]

Check

> dish hasn't moved on the motor shaft.
> motor inclination is spot on.

Some of those birds mentioned are pretty strong, so something major must be at fault. Maybe a picture of your set up will help.

The dish still looks straight on the motor shaft, and it points straight ahead when the motor is at 0.

I have tried messing with the elevation today, and adjusted it to get the best signal on 0.8w, and then did the same again at 19e, and attempted it at 28.2e but got nowhere.

Can you take the motor out of the equation. Mount the dish directly on your mast and see if you can get 28ºE. If not it could be down to the tree being a fraction taller than last year and now it's got some leaves it is blocking the signal. If the tree is 20 metres away like you said it would need to be 10 metres higher than the dish (on 28ºE) to cause a problem.

I can't get it off the motor tbh, the pole is too high above the roof, and I am not a fan of ladders at the best of times, so there isn't a hope in hell that I will get off the ladder and stand on the roof, to try and remove the dish and motor lol.

As for the tree's being 20m away, that is a bit of an estimate tbh it might only be around 10m away, and they are higher than the dish is.

I will try and get some pics on my phone (battery's are flat on the camera ).

 

[Lazarus]

Chainsaw on standby

 

[Huevos]

As for the tree's being 20m away, that is a bit of an estimate tbh it might only be around 10m away, and they are higher than the dish is.

Well work on about 2:1. So if the tree is 10m away and 5 metres taller it will interfere.

 

[cokeaddict]

Ok managed to find some batteries for the camera.

Pics are not great as it kept wanting to use the flash, but you should get an idea.

Dish is pointing at 13°e in the pics.

 

[satelliteman]

Yes if that's on 13°e, those tress are your problem by the look of it. Dish re-site I'm afraid ;)

 

[cokeaddict]

Yes if that's on 13°e, those tress are your problem by the look of it. Dish re-site I'm afraid ;)

Howcome it's never been an issue for the last approx 5 years, but last weekend it suddenly causes a problem if it is the tree's ?

I mean the signal was perfect 1 night, and then nothing the next day, surely the signal would have gradually started to reduce ?

 

[satelliteman]

Well from an installers point of view, your pictures show a possible line of sight issue. The trees have grown to the point of them now affecting those satellites mentioned.

 

[cokeaddict]

Well from an installers point of view, your pictures show a possible line of sight issue. The trees have grown to the point of them now affecting those satellites mentioned.

Well i'm kinda screwed then, as I don't own the tree's and there isn't anywhere else the dish can be mounted (can't go on the front of the house).

And it doesn't look like fitting my CM 1.2m dish is going to help either

 

[Mickha]

Who owns those trees? You can contact the council and ask for them to be trimmed to a reasonable height, which seems to be your only option. From the photographs they seem to be invading your property. Are they overhanging your garden?

 

[cokeaddict]

Who owns those trees? You can contact the council and ask for them to be trimmed to a reasonable height, which seems to be your only option. From the photographs they seem to be invading your property. Are they overhanging your garden?

They do over hang the garden, but I don't own the property either.

 

[Robbo]

Also, over the winter there may not have been leaves on the tree that may be blocking the signal. With no leaves, the signal will pass through not too badly, but once they grow, it won't. You could get an inclinometer and check the angle. Moving the dish to the right or left may help. The dish could probable go a bit higher also, but would need a thicker pole and brackets spaced further apart, and for good measure an extra K.