Supreme Dark Motor - Latitude scale inverted?!!

jeallen01

jeallen01

Specialist Contributor
My Satellite Setup
See Signature
My Location
Somewhere in England (possibly?)!
Bought one of the above (or so I thought?) from Vu Plus UK in N. London a couple of weeks ago and am beginning to set it up.

However, when following the instructions in the manual supplied, and the copy posted by WilliamI on this forum, I note that the latitude scale on both sides of the motor mounting bracket appears to be inverted, i.e. the 25deg marking is at the lower end of the quadrant scale and the 75deg marking is at the top!

Thus, when I set it to the marking for my latitude of 54deg N ,the lower end of the motor arm is actually pointing towards the scaffold pole on which is it mounted - this seems totally wrong to me, but is it?

OTOH, is it possible/probable that I have got a clone mount which has been badly manufactured?

Thanks in advance.

John
 
I just looked at my manual to see and it has 25 top and 75 bottom but elevation, so checked a photo best i could and i think its got latitude on it but cant read the scale. but mine is locked nearer the top but im more or less running level with the scaffold pole and to get the lower end of the motor arm is actually pointing towards the scaffold pole i would need to be 75 so something sounds wrong. cant wait for the photo lol
 
Here are the images of the dish mount - as it is on the scaffolding pole (which IS vertical even if it does not look like in the photo, and I have not yet set the dish at the correct angle on the motor arm!) and a close-up of the scale on the scale on the motor mounting bracket)IMG_0261a.webp IMG_0264a.webp

So, you can see that the lower end of the motor arm is pointing slightly towards the scaffolding pole - and the latitude scale on the motor mount IS marked the opposite way round to the illustrations in the two manuals (although it only goes up to 65deg and not 75deg as I stated from memory yesterday)

PS: will be setting the mount and dish up as much as possible at "ground level" and then pushing it up to the top (about 8ft) for the best E-W arc and for the final adjustments.

PPS: going outside now before it starts pissing again like it did an hour ago - and before that starts again - so will be back later!
 
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DSCN1286[1].webp DSCN1287[1].webp The scale on the motor is just a guide mine is set @ 45 for my location,
I think you need to raise your motor Elevation & lower the dish Declination.

I have found this method to be the most successful after you have established that the pole is dead vertical,
The dish is mounted dead central on the motor spigot,
Your motor elevation is set for your location (use as a guide only) & maximum signal was achieved on your reference satellite by altering the the dish declination & USALS settings of Longitude & Latitude then check out the Lnb position in the Lnb holder is giving you the best possible signal by moving the Lnb fully forward & back to achieve this whilst viewing a signal meter we then move on to stage two,

As the scales for the motor elevation & dish declination are just a guide & not an accurate measuring scale so with the Longitude & Latitude can be altered slightly to improve your dishes ability to track the arc more accurately as with all guides you may find a slight variation on my finding will enable you to track the arc more accurately,

To improve your motor's capability to track the Clarke Belt / Geostationary Satellite's on the Arc make sure that the Motor has been clamped in the correct central position to make tracking the arc accurately possible,
Try this to find out if your dish is set up correctly:-
Go to 30 west or the furthest West your dish will travel now while viewing a signal meter lightly flex the dish back at the top if the signal goes up or down make a note of this now do the same with the bottom of the dish & make a note of what happens,
Now go to 36 east or the furthest East your dish can travel & flex the dish as above,

If your findings are that the signal gets better on the East satellites when the dish was flexed back & the signal gets better on the West satellites when the dish was flexed forward then the motor is fixed to the wrong place on the mast to correct this change your USALS @ your reference satellite from say 0.07 Longitude to 0.4 Longitude now slacken off the motor fixing bolts & move the motor a few mm either way to achieve maximum signal,

Now check you East & West satellites again for maximum signal if it is better then tighten up your Motor at the new position if not then change your USALS to 0.0 Longitude now slacken off the motor fixing bolts & move the motor a few mm either way to achieve maximum signal,
Then check your East & West Satellites again for maximum signal.

Once you have established that you are tracking the Arc more accurately you can fine tune your dish / motor set up by changing USALS by 0.3 to 0.6 from your current best setting then slacken off the motor fixing bolts & move the motor a few mm either way to achieve maximum signal,
 
jeallen01 said:
Here are the images of the dish mount - as it is on the scaffolding pole (which IS vertical even if it does not look like in the photo, and I have not yet set the dish at the correct angle on the motor arm!) and a close-up of the scale on the scale on the motor mounting bracket)View attachment 91942 View attachment 91943

So, you can see that the lower end of the motor arm is pointing slightly towards the scaffolding pole - and the latitude scale on the motor mount IS marked the opposite way round to the illustrations in the two manuals (although it only goes up to 65deg and not 75deg as I stated from memory yesterday)

PS: will be setting the mount and dish up as much as possible at "ground level" and then pushing it up to the top (about 8ft) for the best E-W arc and for the final adjustments.

PPS: going outside now before it starts pissing again like it did an hour ago - and before that starts again - so will be back later!
Click to expand...

I have the same motor - Yours is set way too high - It's currently set to 61 (well unless you live in the Faroe Islands)! London should be around 51-52.
 
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Duh! - Now I see the "problem" - so stupid/simple - I had lined the bolt head on the latitude marking, and not the small scribed line on the moving part of the motor mount which you can see through the slot above the bolt, and that's why it is set at nearly 61N and not 54N for where I am . TBH, I don't think I ever noticed that line before!
:-lol


But also, TBH, the manual does not clearly state that it is that line that you need to set to the required marking - so even RTFM does not quite work in this case (as, sadly, is also the case for many other products from the Far East - "Chinglish" etc.,)

However, this "solution" still does not entirely solve one part of the question I posed initially: why is the scale marking on the actual motor entirely different to the one shown in both the manual that came with the mount and the manual I found linked in this forum - because they clearly state:

"Setting Elevation Angle.(A)


Adjust the motor elevation angle using an inclinoneter or the Latitude scale on one sides of the

Motor according to the Latitude of your position."

And even then the small close-up drawing in the manual of the markings on the quadrant shows that marked as "ELEVATION", and not "LATITUDE", and with the numeric values reading from 25 on the LH end to 75 on the RH end - and not how mine is actually marked (on both sides of the mount). Is this just a case of the manual being "out of date" (been there many times in my line of business), or is it an indicator of some other "problems" that I might encounter?
 
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We've all been there .......
 
You cannot see small scribe line on mine as I use bigger bolt washers so 45 = central position of the bolts = approx 52 on the scale.
 
daaahhnuh said:
I have the same motor - Yours is set way too high - It's currently set to 61 (well unless you live in the Faroe Islands)! London should be around 51-52.
Click to expand...

jeallen01 said:
Duh! - Now I see the "problem" - so stupid/simple - I had lined the bolt head on the latitude marking, and not the small scribed line on the moving part of the motor mount which you can see through the slot above the bolt, and that's why it is set at nearly 61N and not 54N for where I am . TBH, I don't think I ever noticed that line before!.
Click to expand...

Faroe Islands lmfao well least you found the problem with the line :)
 
jeallen01 said:
Duh! - Now I see the "problem" - so stupid/simple - I had lined the bolt head on the latitude marking, and not the small scribed line on the moving part of the motor mount which you can see through the slot above the bolt, and that's why it is set at nearly 61N and not 54N for where I am . TBH, I don't think I ever noticed that line before!
:-lol
Click to expand...

Since you are also using a Triax dish, you also have 2 options for install of the elevation bracket.
 
William

Thanks for the info and guidance as I need to regain some of my long-lapsed "skills" in setting up steerable dishes which I had in the 1990s when, in several locations. I managed to get my old NEC 3000 dish to track very accurately on all the relatively strong birds (it was only a 88-90cm dish) from a little past 30W (further blanked by houses to about 53E (but that Russian bird then "disappeared" when someone built some more houses on the property behind this one.).

However, that old NEC dish used a totally different type of (Jaeger) H-H mount and I have not set up a modern H-H or Diseqc mount before, so all the guidance will be helpful.
 
Now set to 54N and it looks a lot more what I would expect to see (again, done from memory, but I now need to reset it slightly to approx. 51.5N as we are just North of Heathrow).

Thanks again.
 
Channel Hopper
Not sure what you mean by the "two options", even after having downloaded the TDS110 manual because that does seem to give two options - but then absolutely NO instructions on what why you should choose one or the other.

(NB: my dish seems to be sized somewhere between the TDS88 and the TDS110 because it is actually about 98cm tall - although it's "unbranded" and so I think it is a TRIAX unit that was supplied in an intermediate size for contractor-use)

Therefore can you provide a bit more info?

Thanks in advance.
 
Basically, you can mount the elevation bracket either way up.

This gives you two different ranges of elevation settings and allows the same basic design to be used at any latitude.

For your purposes, the choice should be easy to spot and it should be fitted such that you will be able to easily adjust the dish elevation around the mid 20s.

Triax are not alone in providing a reversible bracket - it's very common. Mind you, only Triax could come up with such a cumbersome pig of an elevation slider. Just thank your lucky stars it's not a TD110, requiring three-armed installers to adjust!
 
Lazarus
Thanks with that info then the diagrams in the manual make sense!. OTOH, I picked the dish, mounting bracket and a Silent Gold motor from a recycling site just down the road and so fitted the first two of those directly to the Darkmotor without separating them, so assume (at least I hope!) that the original installer fitted the dish mounting bracket the correct way up!

But, I think the dish might just be a TD (not TDS as I meant to say) version (as I said, it has no brand or model number on it, so I don't know) because, as you say, it looks like I might need more than 2 arms (and strong ones at that) to do the final adjustments. :(
 
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A tip to assist with elevation tuning is to support the weight of the dish by using one hand to exert gentle counterbalancing upward force from a grip at bottom dead centre, and use your other hand (or hands!) to control the spanner. If you try any other grip, the slider will either jam, go out of kilter, or both.
 
Laz..
Thanks, and not so different from doing the same sort of thing with a 36V mount (the old NEC mount was actually 24V, but I inserted a resistor bank to reduce the voltage to the motor when I drove it with the 36V o/p EchoStar & Technomate Rx's ) - i.e gentle tweaking.
 
I'm using a exhaust pipe clamp to support the motor and a rigging skrew to adjust the dish elevation. Moteck's motors has a hole in the pipe for the rigging skrew. I was also running out hands, had find out something.

klemmari.webp
 
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