Upper band Ka reception

[Vipersan]

Ok ..everyone is aware of saorsat ..and the tight footprint for Ireland re circular polarisation..and the relatively inexpensive irdeto lnbs ..
But these are limited to a top frequency around 20,200
..but what about the Eutelsat Ka band C coverage from 7E ?
freq 21.500 approx and linear.
Not only is it linear ..but also out of range for the Irdeto dual ka lnb ..
So ..
Has anyone successfully accessed this territory ?
I'm interested since discovering the footprint does include the UK..
..but what to use ?
Norsat lnbs require a second mortgage on the house to own one...
..are there Any economical ways to get coverage for experimentation ?
rgds
VS

 

[timo_w2s]

I've been thinking the same thing. It's also a bit strange that the Ka band LNBs are still so hard to get hold of, especially for these bands.

 

[solly]

where i can get full band ka band
and feed 2 port ku band and ka band ?

 

[Vipersan]

...Nope I just don't get this at all ..
perhaps I simply don't understand and have the facts wrong ..

Typical example is this from Flysat ..


Onacila
05.04.2013 21605 H
DVB-S/MPEG-2 2480 7/8 TV Zimbo

How is Oncila receiving 21605 H ..when every ka lnb I've spec checked ..including the high end ones at Norsat say...

INPUT C - 20.20 to 21.20 GHz
FREQUENCY


I simply don't get it ..
How can anyone receive a frquency ..if the lnb to do it ...doesn't appear to exist ?
By all means correct me and call me stupid if you want ...

As I once had tagged to all my posts ..

'Tis better to ask and feel stupid ...than to suffer in silence and ignorance'

 

[Topper]

From the figures shown you need another 500MHz that is all am I correct? well how about a scart frequency shifter from the old days, I am not sure if they were notch filtered for a specific frequency range but it may just get you there. Do you have one to try, I may have somewhere myself

 

[Archived-1]

maybe worth asking this ebay seller
Item number: 200829877878 ? the one he is selling here spec is,
Circular Dual Polarity
23mm LNB Neck
19.7-20.2 Ghz
(Lo 21.20 Ghz)
Twin Outputs
HDTV DVB-S2 Compliant
Ultra Low Noise Technology ULN+

 

[Huevos]

VS, I think you've got to forget about the spec. Most important thing is the LO frequency. If you want to receive up to 21600 you are going to need an LO frequency in the region of 22600. Most Ka LNBs seem to be around 21200 which means what you are trying to receive is the wrong side of the LO.

 

[Vipersan]

Now I wonder if both Topper and Huevos are on to something here..
Can we assume that the inverto ka lnbs although geared for circular can 'see' the frequencies I'm targeting ?...but they cannot be tuned because the tuners in conventional receivers don't cover a wide enough area of the spectrum ..?
Much like the old Analogue days and the inception of Astra 1D ..
Where a lot of tuners simply couldn't tune that upper area ..?
and a tweak was introduced in the form of the Global 1D convertor ...which effectively band shifted a chunk of upper spectrum into a lower area that the tuners could 'see' (IF shifting)
Well I had a dig around in my loft last night and found the one I bought many years ago for accessing filmnet..
Would something like this work ??
Designed for use with analogue not digital ..but then IF is IF..
back to the experts..

..of course we still dont have Linear ..and would expect at least a 3db loss using an lnb designed for circular polarisation ..and would require that no opposite polarised signal used the same frequency ..but in theory ????

 

[Captain Jack]

Can't you just remove the depolariser plate to convert the LNB to linear?

 

[Vipersan]

I'm not sure these lnbs have a plate to remove CJ ..
from what I've read the probes are effectively spirals etched on a pcb ..one to received R and one for L ..but I could be wrong of course ..
Something similar was once used in KU back in the days of BskyB..
Only that was dedicated to one polarisation only ..these inverto ones do both ..using the 13/18v switch.

 

[timo_w2s]

I'm not sure these lnbs have a plate to remove CJ ..
from what I've read the probes are effectively spirals etched on a pcb ..one to received R and one for L ..but I could be wrong of course ..
Something similar was once used in KU back in the days of BskyB..
Only that was dedicated to one polarisation only ..these inverto ones do both ..using the 13/18v switch.

Do you mean the old BSB LNBs? I found out that sticking blutack down the feedhorn gave me the other polarity, which was useful when the satellites where sold to Scandinavia and they used the other polarity to BSB.

Of course this isn't going to help you VS in this case, but thought I'd chip in with that anyway. ;)

 

[Marcus_21]

...Nope I just don't get this at all ..
perhaps I simply don't understand and have the facts wrong ..

Typical example is this from Flysat ..


Onacila
05.04.2013 21605 H
DVB-S/MPEG-2 2480 7/8 TV Zimbo

How is Oncila receiving 21605 H ..when every ka lnb I've spec checked ..including the high end ones at Norsat say...

INPUT C - 20.20 to 21.20 GHz
FREQUENCY


I simply don't get it ..
How can anyone receive a frquency ..if the lnb to do it ...doesn't appear to exist ?
By all means correct me and call me stupid if you want ...

As I once had tagged to all my posts ..

'Tis better to ask and feel stupid ...than to suffer in silence and ignorance'

For example there is the Norsat KA-BAND EXT. REF9000XD-3 and KA-BAND PLL9000HD-3.

FREQUENCY BANDS AVAILABLE

Frequency band (GHz) 21.20 to 22.20
L.O. frequency (GHz) 20.25
IF frequency (MHz) 950 to 1950

Hello, Capitan_Uncino

 

[Huevos]

<div>For example there is the Norsat KA-BAND EXT. REF9000XD-3 and KA-BAND PLL9000HD-3.
</div>

At what price?

 

[Vipersan]

REF9000XD-3 and KA-BAND PLL9000HD-3.
..its now on my shopping list ...to be purchased following my first lottery win ..

 

[Marcus_21]

At what price?

Approximately 1500-1800 us dollars, excluding the feedhorn.

 

[Captain Jack]

I'm not sure these lnbs have a plate to remove CJ ..
from what I've read the probes are effectively spirals etched on a pcb ..one to received R and one for L ..but I could be wrong of course ..
Something similar was once used in KU back in the days of BskyB..
Only that was dedicated to one polarisation only ..these inverto ones do both ..using the 13/18v switch.

Now why don't they sell circular C-band LNBs like that? Saves faffing around with chopping boards...

 

[Vipersan]

Now why don't they sell circular C-band LNBs like that? Saves faffing around with chopping boards...

I guess it's a legacy thing ..
C band being broadcast for user reception in both forms Linear and Circular ..and back in the day ..all was catered for with Corotors etc ..
I guess it's just down to demand and economic viability.
remember the voltage switched LNBF came much later and with a simple adaption can do either..

 

[Llew]

I would expect there to be a sharp cut-off in reception of the GHz frequencies we need when contemplating using a Saorsat LNB and an LO frequency shifter for the ka band channes on other satellites.. For instance, the Inverto spans just 0.5GHz (19.7 - 20.2 GHz) whereas the channels for instance on 16E starts at 21.5 GHz - that's over one GHz above the upper limit of the Inverto.

 

[Vipersan]

Almost certainly spot on Llew.
Maybe one day ..a suitable lnb will be available within the price range of non lottery winners..
One can hardly afford to get in at the 'pioneer' stage atm.
I remain Gutted !!!!

£100 even £200 for a hobby I love with a passion ..but £1000 plus ...
That's asking too much

 

[Channel Hopper]

I would expect there to be a sharp cut-off in reception of the GHz frequencies we need when contemplating using a Saorsat LNB and an LO frequency shifter for the ka band channes on other satellites.. For instance, the Inverto spans just 0.5GHz (19.7 - 20.2 GHz) whereas the channels for instance on 16E starts at 21.5 GHz - that's over one GHz above the upper limit of the Inverto.

There should be little within the LNB that filters out the upper frequencies required, the specification is written as such because the manufacturer has probably not tested beyond the 500MHz required by whichever broadcaster is within the band of interest.

If your receiver has a tuner with the usual 950 to 2150 MHz span, then you should get a sniff of anything coming down the cable that falls within those limits.