Advice Needed Astra 28E footprint

[GaryWC]

I have recently been working on a few jobs in the South of France, Monaco, St Tropez etc and have noticed a significant decrease in signal on Astra 28.2E, I know that they have been changing the footprint a lot recently but I am now losing specific channels, mainly HD channels. Has anyone else had this problem and know what actions could be taken to restore the lost channels.
I have tried installing an amp and have increased the signal by 15dB but still without luck.

 

[wod]

Larger dish needed or to realign the dish you have?

 

[PaulR]

You don't say what size dishes you're using at the moment but it's most likely they're now too small. At the other end of the Med around Montpellier 1.2m appears to be the new norm.

Up in the Vaucluse my 85cm is fine in good weather but only needs the slightest hint of bad weather for the HD channels to pixelate. Anything more than light rain and the SD channels go as well. Across the village an 80cm I installed some years ago for some friends shows it's right on the lower limit as they lose SD signal in the afternoon sometimes. Boy, were they upset when Wimbledon was on! So 1m is probably what's needed here now.

Unless you have very long and/or lossy cables an amp won't do any good.

 

[GaryWC]

You don't say what size dishes you're using at the moment but it's most likely they're now too small. At the other end of the Med around Montpellier 1.2m appears to be the new norm.

Up in the Vaucluse my 85cm is fine in good weather but only needs the slightest hint of bad weather for the HD channels to pixelate. Anything more than light rain and the SD channels go as well. Across the village an 80cm I installed some years ago for some friends shows it's right on the lower limit as they lose SD signal in the afternoon sometimes. Boy, were they upset when Wimbledon was on! So 1m is probably what's needed here now.

Unless you have very long and/or lossy cables an amp won't do any good.

Thanks Paul,

Im using a 1 meter stabilized Seatel antenna, the cable runs are about 50-60 meters.
I have only started noticing issues from mid-late 2014, im pretty sure it was around the time of the world cup as we had a lot of calls regarding the loss of bbc channels, I guess its the bbc's way off tightening restrictions for non license payers abroad.
I have tried everything except a larger antenna which may not be viable for the customer.

Gary

 

[Analoguesat]

Its worth being aware that 2E is slotted at 28.5E - where Eutelsat 28A used to operate. On big dishes you may need to adjust the dish to optimise whnich satellite the customer gets.

 

[dmaavrigdo]

Yesterday morning I adjusted my 1.2m dish 1/4" to the West at the lnb to improve Channel 5 but had to put it back to get the more important (to us) channels on 2E without glitches.

 

[PaulR]

I really think you're stuck between a rock and a hard place if you can't go to larger dishes. As you go further towards Italy you even find that a 1.5m dish is needed.

When you tried the amplifiers, where did you put them? Some of us here say that on a long run (and 50 to 60 metres getting up in that region) then it should be right next to the LNB. Others say that it should be in the middle of the run. We're all agreed that it should not be up by the receiver though.

If you're using Seatel gear does this mean that they're installed on boats? In which case I can understand what you're saying about size limits.

 

[GaryWC]

I really think you're stuck between a rock and a hard place if you can't go to larger dishes. As you go further towards Italy you even find that a 1.5m dish is needed.

When you tried the amplifiers, where did you put them? Some of us here say that on a long run (and 50 to 60 metres getting up in that region) then it should be right next to the LNB. Others say that it should be in the middle of the run. We're all agreed that it should not be up by the receiver though.

If you're using Seatel gear does this mean that they're installed on boats? In which case I can understand what you're saying about size limits.

Yes that's correct they are fitted to yachts, so as you say size and weight is a big factor, I have been putting the amps by the LNB to try to amplify the good signal, my thoughts are if you put the LNB further down the cable run you are simply amplifying the poor signal at that point including the noise.

I think the customer will have to live with what they have.

 

[PaulR]

...my thoughts are if you put the LNB further down the cable run you are simply amplifying the poor signal at that point including the noise.

My thoughts exactly although some would disagree.

Have you thought of an Internet solution for the yacht owners? You'd need a decent 3G or 4G connection in the yachts (I presume that wired would be inconvenient) and then make arrangements in the UK for a VPN. It's all doable but expensive although if there are enough customers the VPN costs could come down.

 

[hairybadger]

As a test have you tried a short cable run? ie take the receiver out to the dish.... Maybe the cable has deteriorated (water ingress). Maybe a cable with better shielding would help. I'll assume you've already tried swapping out the LNB. I've never seen an improvement using an amplifier (right next to the LNB ) but then my cable runs are relatively short (17m or so).

 

[GaryWC]

My thoughts exactly although some would disagree.

Have you thought of an Internet solution for the yacht owners? You'd need a decent 3G or 4G connection in the yachts (I presume that wired would be inconvenient) and then make arrangements in the UK for a VPN. It's all doable but expensive although if there are enough customers the VPN costs could come down.

Yes, I know people who advise to put the amp next to the receiver, it makes no sense.

Yeah internet solution is sorted we have installed a dual Seatel arbitrated VSAT system (1.2mtr antennas). We have also installed a conrod antenna with a 4G router for when the vessel is in/close to port

 

[GaryWC]

As a test have you tried a short cable run? ie take the receiver out to the dish.... Maybe the cable has deteriorated (water ingress). Maybe a cable with better shielding would help. I'll assume you've already tried swapping out the LNB. I've never seen an improvement using an amplifier (right next to the LNB ) but then my cable runs are relatively short (17m or so).

We have been using a spectrum analyzer to check the signal level from the LNB all the way to the modem checking at all connection points in-between and have found minimal loss. We are using LMR600 cable so pretty chunky stuff easily capable of runs up to 150m.
Yes we have tested the LNB which is fine, I have suggested to try connecting the receiver directly to the lnb but it is quite difficult as the antenna is quite high up a mast with limited access, I am waiting for the onboard engineer to get back to me on this one.

 

[mubeen]

astra 28.2 all transponders is now moving on astra 2G

 

[Analoguesat]

astra 28.2 all transponders is now moving on astra 2G

No they arent - the load will continue to be spread over 2E 2F & 2G.

 

[mubeen]

astra 2g is coverage in middle east ?

 

[Analoguesat]

astra 2g is coverage in middle east ?

Near enough nil

 

[Captain Jack]

Which one has a spot beam once ME? 2E/F?

 

[timo_w2s]

Which one has a spot beam once ME? 2E/F?

2E has the ME beam (see attached) but I don't think it's very active yet, 2G and 2F cover West Africa.