Astra 2F: Iberia & Balearics Discussion

[Analoguesat]

Ciutadella de Menorca - 120 x 130 offset with Grundig quad LNB.

Have just checked Sky EPG 188, 501 & 619. Good signal strength and quality on all three as seen on my Amstrad 890 Sky+ HD receiver.

By the way, EPG 188 is Fox HD not SD as you've indicated above.

Regards

Dratted HD boxes.

SD was good enough for my grandad, its good enough for me ;)

 

[davidcmadrid]

Madrid geographic Center.

1.2M motorized Black Ultra LNB

vu+uno 50m appx cable with 1 join.

12207 MHZ SNR 80%
12109 MHz SNR 86%

 

[Juan69]

What is the current position in Malaga?. I will be traveling down next week and I am wondering if i should bother to take the meters and stuff, because I am sure the winds will have shifted the dishes in my absence. Any reception down there?.

 

[eubster]

Evening all. You can see my set up in my profile, but I've just started losing the ASTRA 2F transponders in the evening when it rains (even light rain). Signal strength is still good at 70%, but with the rain, the qulity goes right down to 30/40% according to my HUMAX FOXSAT HD box and the channels are unwatchable. Is this just a case of requiring a larger dish? If so, how much bigger? All ideas welcome!

Thanks,
Eubster

 

[davidcmadrid]

Eubster, I can confirm no change in SNR on 11023H here in Madrid. Im unsure from your post if its a recent phenomenon when you say " just started " . What part of France are you in ?

 

[Lazarus]

Difficult to say unless you state your location a tad more precisely than "France": Dish size varies from 60cm in the North to over a metre in the South, South East etc.

 

[eubster]

Sorry, should have been more clear. I'm in Toulouse to be precise, and I've only noticed it recently with all the heavy rain we've been having. In clear weather, all the 2F transponders are receivable with 80% strength and between 50-60% quality, but I think that means I've pretty much got no margin, so as soon as it rains significantly the quality drops to 40% or lower and the signal is unwatchable. I've got no digital meter so my tuning has been purely manual just to get the best signal, but not specifically for the 2F transponders so maybe a tweak could get me a few more percent, but othwerwise I'm open to suggestions (including a new dish). Thanks to all in advance.

 

[timo_w2s]

First thing I'd do it check the alignment if you have easy access to the dish. I've installed a few dishes in fringe areas without a meter, just by watching the receiver's quality readings on a TV by the dish. It can require a lot of time and patience, even over tightening one bolt on the mount can pull the dish off course for a weak channel and make the difference between receiving a channel and nothing.

 

[PaulR]

Hi eubster. You haven't said what size your dish is but I would think that you'll need at least an 80cm dish, 90cm preferably, that far south. Up in the Vaucluse, my friends have noticed no difference on their reception using an 80cm (or 85cm) dish so that would be my starting point.

If your dish is already up at this size then, as suggested by others, you need to check your alignment, etc.

 

[Lazarus]

That Visiosat 90cm dish mentioned in your profile is definitely marginal for 2F judging by other reports from down your way, but it's hard to advise specifics for upgrading as the next big change will be when Astra 2E becomes operational later this year.

 

[alec]

, even over tightening one bolt on the mount can pull the dish off course for a weak channel and make the difference between receiving a channel and nothing.

As I can confirm after spending hours setting up my new Gibertini 1 m on 2F just using the receiver (Topfield - Humax mostly gives "no or bad signal" on 2F). Slightly better than the previous Optex 80 cm - 4/seven and patchy C5 during the morning/early afternoon - but still no "Ice Road Truckers" on Friday evenings .

@ timo - would be very interested in your thoughts on whether buying a decent meter (or bringing in an installer who has one) is likely to give a significant improvement.

The annoying/surprising thing is that 2 friends in the same town are both getting C5 etc. 24/7 (heavy rain excepted) on 70 cm dishes with supermarket LNBs - in one case with wires joined by just being twisted together - although many other people have the same problem as me.

I am about 100 k southeast of eubster

 

[timo_w2s]

@ timo - would be very interested in your thoughts on whether buying a decent meter (or bringing in an installer who has one) is likely to give a significant improvement.

I'm not the best person to ask really as I've never had the pleasure of using anything other than a basic meter with a few flashing LEDs or a needle giving a basic reading across the entire frequency range. This is useful for finding the approximate satellite location but I always prefer to see an on screen weak channel when fine tuning. A receiver that can tune to individual channels for signal quality readings with some kind of numbers such as % or dB is essential for me.

I've installed a 1.8m dish in Helsinki to get 2D when everyone else was saying I'd need a 2.4m, an 85cm in Lapland that used to get south beam channels, and countless other dishes to try and get every last drop of signal.

I've used installers a couple of times but I always got the impression they where used to working on local satellites with strong signals where alignment isn't quite so critical and doesn't want to spend too long tweaking a dish. You need to find a specialist who understands the situation.

 

[alec]

I've installed a 1.8m dish in Helsinki to get 2D when everyone else was saying I'd need a 2.4m, an 85cm in Lapland that used to get south beam channels, and countless other dishes to try and get every last drop of signal.

but I always prefer to see an on screen weak channel when fine tuning

Thks for the reply - I did the same but the main problem (esp. when tightening the bolts) was having to rely on another person to shout "better, worse, terrible etc.". The quality varies quite a bit even within a few minutes, so I'm not sure I have the best possible alignment.

If you're ever in this corner of France... :-beer

 

[timo_w2s]

Thks for the reply - I did the same but the main problem (esp. when tightening the bolts) was having to rely on another person to shout "better, worse, terrible etc.". The quality varies quite a bit even within a few minutes, so I'm not sure I have the best possible alignment.

If you're ever in this corner of France... :-beer

Haha thanks, although right now I'm at the other extreme of Europe in Lapland.

I bought myself a small cheap portable LCD TV (about the size of an iPad mini) with built in rechargeable battery and a long video cable that I can plug into the back of a receiver. It's very handy for fine tuning dishes with (and positioning CCTV cameras).

 

[eubster]

Many thanks to all of you for your useful suggestions. Tivu makes a good point about 2E....so I think I'll probably just live with it for now (theoretically it's not supposed to rain that much down in this part of the world!) and once the new sat is up there and broadcasting, I'll re-assess. I checked again and in fact as my dish is an offset, it is in fact 1m tall and 90cm wide, so I have no idea whether you classify that as a 90cm or a 1m.

Nevertheless, a quick look on the 2galli site indicates that the next step up is probably 1.2M. I don't have room on the roof for something much bigger than that although I'm unsure how much difference that would make. I guess the gain is the most important (Experts please correct me if I'm wrong) factor. The blurb indicates that my current dish has a gain 39.7db at 12750 Ghz and the 1.2M would have a gain of 41.8db at the same frequncy. Is that a significant difference?

Thanks,

 

[timo_w2s]

Yes, no point spending too much time and money at the moment until 2E turns up.

A 100cm x 90cm dish would be classed as 90cm by most people but apparently in Spain they seem to call it a 1m.

I would have thought a 90cm -> 1.2m would have a bit higher gain than what you quoted.

 

[Menorca Man]

An article written by Menorca's main Sky installer that appeared in the February Menorca-Live newsletter.

h**p://menorca-live.com/postcard-to-menorca/changes-to-satellite-reception-in-menorca

If the dish sizes he quotes turn out to be correct then I'm scuppered as there is no way I can (or will be allowed to) mount anything that large on the roof of my apartment block!! In any case, the prices he estimates for installation seem horrendous. Are such costs typical??

Regards

 

[Lazarus]

The thrust of the article is more or less on the right lines, though the fine detail is lacking: It doesn't, for example mention the launch of Astra 2E, but to be honest we've seen stuff coming from so-called Installers/Experts in mainland Spain that have been wrong in most respects, so kudos to your guy.

 

[Huevos]

the prices he estimates for installation seem horrendous. Are such costs typical??

Well if he has no competition he can charge what he likes. Anyway as far as dish pricing goes the retail price of the parts should be somewhere near the following:

Famaval 1.8m PF, dish 450€, kingpost 50€, Feedhorn 25€, LNB 30-70€ (depending on number of ports and the brand).
Famaval 2.4m PF, dish 900€, kingpost 65€, Feedhorn 25€, LNB 30-70€.

I'd say a competitive inclusive price for a 1.8m dish install is in the 750-800€ range, plus the price of a concrete base if one is necessary.

 

[Juan69]

What is the current position in Malaga?. I will be traveling down next week and I am wondering if i should bother to take the meters and stuff, because I am sure the winds will have shifted the dishes in my absence. Any reception down there?.

Just returned from Malaga where all is as good as was except for the Five cluster.