Cannot get signal from any satellite other than 28.2

[James Williamson]

Hi all,

It's poor practice to just send a post before searching through the forum to see if someone else has asked the same question. However, I can't seem to find anything that answers my question.

I'm trying to improve my French, and also encourage the family to learn as we're thinking of buying a house in France, so have decided to try and get Fransat working. My progress so far has been to successful point a dish at 28.2 E and get Freesat both using a TV with freesat built in and an Openbox V8S. I've done this with a variety of dishes, from a portable one the size of a large dinner plate to a 110 cm dish mounted on a tripod stand - of course all bought from ebay..

I've done a bit of research and bought a Fransat receiver box which comes with a card which unscrambles the channels. However, I can't see to get any signal at all when I point my dish(es) at Eutelsat 5 West A, I've tried adding a satellite on the Openbox V8S it but am still unable to get a signal. Likewise with the Fransat receiver. I've bought a miltary compass, etc, and learnt (via some considerable frusrtation) the rookie mistake that metal objects will distort the signal significantly. I've obviously spent some time playing with elevation. The mobile phone apps don't seem to work for me as the compass doesn't seem to be reliable, I'm using a fairly modern phone too - Samsung S8.

As far as I understand it, I should be able to at least receive a signal on Openbox V8S which I bought as a testing unit to see if could lock on to other satellites other than 28.2. Am I missing something - should I just go and buy a motorised dish if it's purely a case of alignment? I've added Astra A on the Openbox to see if I could lock onto another satellite, no joy there either. Is there something I'm missing? I'm happy to pay for help, I'm based in Watlington, Oxfordshire.

Many thanks,

James

 

[Mickha]

Welacome to the forum James.

Finding a satellite isn't easy, even if you know roughly where to point the dish, which is why a satellite meter, even the cheapest version, always helps:

You can buy one of these for less than £10, on the internet, or even at a local DIY store, and they are very easy to use.

You connect one end to your LNB, the other to the cable attached to your receiver, and if everything is working it should light up.
You then make it more sensitive, by turning the knob to the left, until the meter reads 5, about half way, it will do this even if the dish is pointing to the ground.
You then gently move your dish, East/West, Left/Right, until the meter reads 10, adjust the sensitivity, by turning the knob to the right, until it reads 5 again, and move your dish again, until it reads 10, adjust the sensitivity, again, and keep doing this until you have the strongest signal.
You then do the same with the elevation.
Once you have the strongest signal, possible, you scan some channels in, on your receiver, and check which satellite you're on, by using sites like lyngsat.com, or kingofsat.net.

To get a rough guide, of where to point your dish try dishpointer.com.
Type in your postcode, select a satellite, from the drop down box, zoom in on the map, and move the green icon to your house, and where your dish is located.

Please post back, with your progress, and if you have any questions.

 

[Lazarus]

Welcome to the Forum.

I'd hold off on going motorised ..... that's a more convoluted exercise than installing and aligning a fixed dish.

5W is a very strong Satellite, easily receivable in the UK on a small dish. And it has the added advantage of few receivable close neighbours ...... 7/8W are far too weak for a small dish and so you probably only have Thor at 0.8W as a possible wrong 'un.

I suggest you use something in the middle of the range of sizes you have: The 110cm is massive overkill and the dinner plate has a wide acceptance angle. Something around 60 to 80cm has the advantage of being relatively easy to manoeuvre and should be plenty big enough.

The fact you've had no success suggests a fundamental error .... dish face should be slightly above vertical, LNB skew should be close to zero. Often people point the dish too high, failing to account for the offset angle inherent in the dish.

 

[James Williamson]

Welcome to the Forum.

I'd hold off on going motorised ..... that's a more convoluted exercise than installing and aligning a fixed dish.

5W is a very strong Satellite, easily receivable in the UK on a small dish. And it has the added advantage of few receivable close neighbours ....... 7/8W are far too weak for a small dish and so you probably only have Thor at 0.8W as a possible wrong 'un.

I suggest you use something in the middle of the range of sizes you have: The 110cm is massive overkill and the dinner plate has a wide acceptance angle. Something around 60 to 80cm has the advantage of being relatively easy to manoeuvre and should be plenty big enough.

The fact you've had no success suggests a fundamental error .... dish face should be slightly above vertical, LNB skew should be close to zero. Often people point the dish too high, failing to account for the offset angle inherent in the dish.

 

[Lazarus]

^^^^^^ Spot of finger trouble! Quote but no added text .... have another go and then I'll tidy up

 

[TJExcalibur]

I have just installed a 68 cm dish for Fransat. Easy to get it wrong and I have installed many dishes over the years. Even with a signal meter you can pick up an adjacent satellite. Best go to dishpointer. com. Put in your local details, choose the 5 west satellite from the list and you almost there. You will see it shows the direction the dish should be pointing, if you can get behind the dish and line it up all the better. Now its a case of moving the dish on the elevation a little at a time. I always find it best to put some grease on the pole and elevation bracket as it helps it move easy when the bolts are pinched tight.

 

[Topper]

It would help us all if you posted a couple of photgraphs of your dish but in the meantime it should look something like this when correctly aligned

 

[Analoguesat]

The bast thing to do for beginners is to "hop" round the arc one satellite at at time from a known starting point. 28E - 23E - 19E - 13E - 9E - 5E - 1W - 5W.

Each jump will be about the width of the head of a standard lnb, so if you go well past that sort of distance you need to back up and start from the last locked signal.

Alternatively the sun is due south at noon. On a sunny morning set the sun so the reflection off the dish is shining on the lnb cap. This time of year its very close to the satellite arc so go westwards the width of the lnb cap or so and you should be pretty close to 5W.

Good luck & please let us know how you get on

 

[James Williamson]

Hi,

Many thanks for your replies, I actually bought the 110cm by accident, I wasn't really thinking how big it was. I've now got a 80cm dish which is
manageable. Using an audible dish finder device and a compass I'm convinced I'm managed to find Astra 19.2 and the 5W satellite. The signal on my openbox shows this when I have it set for the 28.2E satellite but am pointing towards the 19E, I'm pretty sure this is correct as my compass tells me I'm looking directly at it and I remember reading somewhere that receivers don't know which satellite they're looking at when they're reporting signal strength/quality.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/sXmyYmXhyZ2bmQCj1

However the signal bars totally drop when I change the openbox to the 2A satellite, the finder box is screaming at me and of course it shows full strength if the 28.E satellite is selected within Openbox.

Do I need to do anything extra to the receiver when I change the satellite?

Thanks,

James

 

[Terryl]

Try Dishpointer.com, it will help you find the satellites a bit better then just swinging the dish around.

You enter your location then select the satellite your looking for, this will give you a map, zoom into your location and click on it where your dish is located, this will then give you a marker and a line pointing to the satellite from that location, you will also get dish skew or LNB skew and the correct dish elevation settings for that satellite.

The AZ and elevation settings will be different for all satellites as they lie in an arc across the sky, setting the dish for one satellite and just swinging it around may miss the next one.

Also Dishpointer has an app for your phone, that way you can be standing or sitting behind the dish (if possible) and look directly at the satellites location, this will help find the satellite a bit faster.

You must remember that there are three settings for the proper aliment of the dish, one is the direction to point it, (azimuth true or magnetic South/North (this depends on what side of the Equator you live on)) elevation, (how high to point it up in the air, 0 to 90 degrees) and LNB or dish skew. (how much the dish or LNB needs to be turned (clock wise or counter clock wise) to align to the proper polarization to receive the transponders.

If the two satellites are close to each other (10 degrees or less) then moving the dish a few degrees left or right (very slowly) may get you the next one if your lucky.

 

[Ghostleader]

Hi,

Many thanks for your replies, I actually bought the 110cm by accident, I wasn't really thinking how big it was. I've now got a 80cm dish which is
manageable. Using an audible dish finder device and a compass I'm convinced I'm managed to find Astra 19.2 and the 5W satellite. The signal on my openbox shows this when I have it set for the 28.2E satellite but am pointing towards the 19E, I'm pretty sure this is correct as my compass tells me I'm looking directly at it and I remember reading somewhere that receivers don't know which satellite they're looking at when they're reporting signal strength/quality.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/sXmyYmXhyZ2bmQCj1

However the signal bars totally drop when I change the openbox to the 2A satellite, the finder box is screaming at me and of course it shows full strength if the 28.E satellite is selected within Openbox.

Do I need to do anything extra to the receiver when I change the satellite?

Thanks,

James

Your right in what you say James, a receiver doesn't know what Sat your actually "feeding it" as it were, it's like having a radio station tuned in and stored on your car radio, up here we have a station Clyde 1 FM it's on 102.5 FM but if you start driving down the Ayrshire coast there's another station on that FM slot so your stereo eventually starts "playing" that to you as you drive as it's on the exact same frequency and the radio is just doing it's job of keeping the signal it receives on 102.5.

 

[Ghostleader]

What your best doing is changing the sat to 28E and choosing an active transponder from the list we know is working and on 28E from the list, do have a stored transponder/or channel list for the 28E UK channels??

 

[Analoguesat]

Hi,

Many thanks for your replies, I actually bought the 110cm by accident, I wasn't really thinking how big it was. I've now got a 80cm dish which is
manageable. Using an audible dish finder device and a compass I'm convinced I'm managed to find Astra 19.2 and the 5W satellite. The signal on my openbox shows this when I have it set for the 28.2E satellite but am pointing towards the 19E, I'm pretty sure this is correct as my compass tells me I'm looking directly at it and I remember reading somewhere that receivers don't know which satellite they're looking at when they're reporting signal strength/quality.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/sXmyYmXhyZ2bmQCj1

However the signal bars totally drop when I change the openbox to the 2A satellite, the finder box is screaming at me and of course it shows full strength if the 28.E satellite is selected within Openbox.

Do I need to do anything extra to the receiver when I change the satellite?

Thanks,

James

The only way to positively identify which satellite you have found is to scan a few channels & see what turns up. When looking for 28E use 10714H 22000 5/6 which is the C4 frequency. Its massively strong & dead easy to find.

If you scan & get mainly Germanb chabnels you have 19E. mainly Italian & Arabic channels 13E. Mainly Balkan 16E etc.

 

[James Williamson]

Hi,

All working now thanks, I was using dishpointer before I posted but I think the addition of this is invaluable - https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0140X8OVO/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It has a spyhole and a crosshair, fantastic piece of kit.

My old finder box was broken which didn't help, a case of being left out in the rain.

As from my first post, I knew I was looking at a satellite but was confused why the receiver was reporing 0 signal, but would report a full signal
on a already set-up satellite. I ran a scan and hey presto...

Thanks,

James

 

[Topper]

Success Well done

 

[Analoguesat]

Ah thats excellent news - thanks fot letting us know.