Advice Needed Dish alignment from 13.0E to 28.2E with probable obstacles

anonimity

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Hi all,

I have a seemingly easy task. I want to realign my wall mounted sly dish from Hotbird 13E back to Astra 28.2E.
A photo of the dish is included.

dishpointer.jpg

I also bought a satfinder to help me do it.

What I have to do is turn the dish east to Astra and adjust the elevation a bit (lower it around 4 degrees according to dishpointer website). As you see in the photo there are two elevation screw marks (Hotbird, Astra) so I know more or less where to vertically place the dish. Same stands for the horizontal alignment by watching neighbours dishes.

So, I set my tuner (vu+ solo) to BBC1 (tried also other free channels) on Astra and slightly turn the dish towards Astra. There is no signal indication whatsoever. Of course when I turn it back to Hotbird signal peaks ok.

As you may imagine, after several tries I also manage to lose Hotbird signal.
Now, the satfinder doesn't beep anywhere which I find strange.

I am located in SE London and I start wondering whether the nice trees in front of the dish make my job hard. Have a look on the second pic to get an idea, I also mark the approximate satellite positions.

IMAG0032.jpg

I know for a fact that there is Astra reception as I used to watch it on the past.

Therefore, any help and encouragement will be much appreciated.
I don't want to spend money on an installer again for such an easy task, as I did to switch from Astra to Hotbid.

I was expecting the satfinder indicator to beep often as it happens with all the tutorial videos I've watched but apparently it's not the case.
Do you think is a case of micro-tuning or I have to do something different due to the trees
My LNB skew is set at 3.

Thanks and sorry for the long post.

IMAG0033.jpg
 
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Lazarus

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Watching the neighbours' dishes to get the Azimuth near is not of value: Major Satellite positions are 3 degrees or less apart and your perspective alone is likely to result in the wrong position being attained.

However, if the mark-up showing line of sight to 28E is correct, you won't succeed anyway as it appears to be occluded. How did you establish those mark-ups: Dishpointer? ie How do they correctly account for Elevation?

As for the Beeper, they come with a poor quality cable stub which will either fail to connect properly to the LNB owing to the flimsy inner core, or the core will break or it can easily become trapped and short across to the sheath. I suggest you make up a short patch cable for yourself.

Once you've done that, you may need to reboot your Box in case the short-circuit protection on the 13/18v LNB supply has operated.
 

Analoguesat

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Oh dear - that 3rd pic doesnt look promising for 28E! I take it the trees have grown somewhat in recent years!

If 28E is behind the tree then you have 3 choices

1) cut the tree back
2) raise the dish so it sees over the tree
3) relocate the dish to somewhere where you have clear Line Of Sight


I had similar problems here a few years ago with tree growth - I ended up moving our dishes halfway down the garden so it could see round the troublesome trees. I couldnt cut the trees back as they werent in our garden
 

anonimity

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Thanks for the quick replies.

I have included also a pic of dishpointer which shows an obstacle.

@Tivù The elevation marks on the pic are arbitrary... Horizontal marks are aprox. valid. Beeping is working properly when I restart the tuner.

@Analoguesat There are several dishes pointing to Astra through the trees, even one the balcony below.

What I don't understand if that if say I hit by chance a different satellite? Am I supposed to get a signal indication or because I'm tuned to a channel on Astra I don't get any and have to micro tune it first.

If a raise the dish over the trees do I have to change something else?
 

Analoguesat

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As you probably realise the satellites are at an elevation of about 25 degrees above the horizon, so you may find they are higher than you expect.

As long as you have clear LOS it doesnt matter if you are peeking through gaps in the trees, peeking under the branches, seeing over the top etc, but if you are only just clearing the trees you will have problems in a few years time.

If you have to move the dish, if you can keep it on the same wall you should stay fairly close to the original alignment as long as the dish doesnt slide round any pole, and the pole doesnt rotate in its mounts. Mark everything up with indelible marker BEFORE you start so you can quickly reset!
 

Topper

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The standard signal path for an offset dish is as shown, looking at the last photo, it suggests to me that the trees are indeed in the way however that makes the arc lower in the sky than I would expect, unless the
photo was taken with an angle to begin with
dish.jpg
 

anonimity

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Now is a bit late for markings... but I recall where the elevation setting for Hotbird was.
Shall I fix it there or say just a tiny bit lower?
And then scan carefully horizontally?

I was expecting the sat-finder to help me through the process, but it seems to be useless as it can't pick a signal from an estimated position.
I don't think I aim so inaccurately!

And just to clarify this: It will only beep if I pick up the signal of the satellite my receiver is tuned to? Correct?

I also add a dishpointer photo.
dishpointer.jpg
 
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Analoguesat

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Reset to 13E. Then hop round the arc finding one sat at a time.

16E 10720H 27500 3/4 - Slovenia & Croatia.

19E 10744H 22000 5/6 - German nationals

23.5E 11914H 27500 3/4 - Dutch regionals.

28E - hopefully bingo! :D


if you get halfway round then nothing you will know the trees are in the way - all these should be strong enough to get on a minidish
 

anonimity

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Newbie question. How am I supposed to tune to other satellites?
As I understand I have to to tune the receiver to a channel on say 16E and then pick the satellite with the sat finder.
Am I missing something?
 

Analoguesat

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Just tune the receiver and move the dish a little at a time.

The receiver doesnt know where the frequencies are coming from - the channels and frequency lists are just held in internal databases. If it sees a signal it will display the channels on that signal.
 

anonimity

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I have installed a predefined list of channels and tune it according to which satellite I'm trying to pick.
I guess that has the same results, correct?
 

Analoguesat

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Umm dunno to be honest - Ive never tried it that way - I load the frequencies I want then scan them.
 

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What kind of satellite meter are you using?
If it's a cheap, standard, one, the type I use, it will have a knob, on the front, and a needle. The meter should light up and when you turn the knob, to the left, to increase sensitivity, you should get a reading, even if you're not pointing at a satellite.
Get this to midway, about 5, then turn the dish, when you get close, to a satellite, it will increase to 10, then turn it to the right, to decrease sensitivity, and continue moving the dish, it should move back to 10, keep moving it to 5, then back up to 10, by nudging the dish, including the elevation, until you get the strongest signal possible. Once done check your receiver to see which satellite you're aligned to.
 

anonimity

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I managed to pick Astra!

I am embarrassed to say that the satfinder was not activated yesterday, that's why I didn't get any signal indication.
That happened because I the receiver tuned to a channel instead of performing a scan!

After I made it beep it took like 5 mins to fine tune!

Thanks very much for the replies!
 

Lazarus

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Excellent news :)

No need to be embarrassed at all - there is nobody out there who has never made a booboo!
 

Analoguesat

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Great stuff - thanks for letting us know you have succeeded.

You can be very proud of your achievement - you have done it with a bit of support & advice.

As Tivu says we have all made goofs when installing stuff, - eg I bet there isnt a member on the entire forum who hasnt aligned a dish with great precision onto the wrong satellite at some point during their lives :D
 

Lazarus

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I resemble that remark :oops:
 

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you manage to get 28.2 reception through those trees in your 3rd pic?!?!?! Check out this I couldn't get a fix on!

sat-png.53642


What receiver did you use to check you had signal?
 
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