Advice Needed Expert help needed. Totally stumped!

SatSap

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Hi, my first post here, and I have an issue with freesat reception which is spinning me out.


About 4 weeks ago I bought a new 46" F range Samsung TV with freeview and freesat tuners (two freesat/sat connectors for PVR use). Never ever had a dish on the house before, so called out an installer and had a dish installed a few days later. After they left I went through all the freesat channels, not just the ones they showed me (HD channels), and discovered that I wasn't able to watch 18 of the channels on showing on the freesat epg ...weak signal/check connections was the message on a black screen when I tried to watch them. So I called the aerial installers back and they said the dish was aligned perfectly and that it was my new TV that was the issue as it wasn't tuning in properly ...said it scanned Eutelsat 28.5 and not Astra 28.2. As I'd already looked at the settings, I said that it scanned both and showed them the TV freesat channel list and at the bottom both satellites were listed and you can switch to either independently, and choose to have TV, free channels or radio or all channels etc. They said it wasn't anything they'd ever come across, and they wouldn't try to move the dish or realign it unless I paid them another £45 + VAT to do it. They then got a battered old Sky box with no remote out of their van and connected one of the sides of the shotgun cable (Bskyb black shotgun cable is what they used) from my TV to the sky box and used my tele's scart to RGB adaptor to plug it into my TV. They found the channels that I wasn't able to get but on totally different channel numbers and said, 'see, it's your tele' and left. I contacted Samsung and explained and they said it was definitely an alignment issue and not the TV. So after forking out for a new dish install I reluctantly got another company in to check the dish and or move the dish if necessary. They said the signal was low where the dish was mounted and so moved it to my chimney from the back wall of the house so it had clear line of sight between blocks of flats. They said the signal was vastly improved and the dish now had a clear line of sight and no trees would get in the way. They then checked the channels that I wasn't able to receive and flip me if they still didn't show up! So far (for both installers) it has cost me £165 quid. The second installer chap came back from his van and unpacked a brand new Sky box. Never been used, and had to break seals on batteries and box etc and plugged it into an HDMI port....so wasn't an old effort like the one the previous installer used. A few moments later he was showing me the missing channels on my TV. Said it could be a faulty tuner, but he doubted that, or it was something to do with the way the TV scanned. So I phoned Samsung again and explained fully, but they still insist it is an alignment or dish problem and not the TV. They said that as the TV was getting the rest of the channels it must be something to do with the dish. This is driving me absolutely crazy and costing a packet. I'm at the point where I am thinking about trying to return the TV because I can't believe it should be this difficult to get freesat set up on a TV designed for freesat.

These are the channels that I can't get - they show on freesat guide but when viewing display 'weak signal/check connections'

142
302
303
500
501
502
503
505
506
603
604
605
606
690
810
811
812
813

If anyone can offer me any advice or shed any light on this I'd be very grateful. Can't keep spending money on having the dish moved and aligned. Crazy. Being a total new to satellite I'm at a loss (scuse the pun) as to what the heck is going on.
 

mariust5

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Did you try a factory settings of the TV ? Than rescan ?
It might be a weak tuner on the TV that's not pulling enough signal in which case you might need a bigger dish ...
 

SatSap

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Yes, the TV has been factory reset three times now. Still no joy.
 

sonnetpete

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The ones you've listed are the weaker channels (weaker is a relative term as the signal should strong enough under normal circumstances). It does point towards a dish problem. Either there are still obstructions or the alignment is slightly out, perhaps the LNB skew needs adjusting...do you know which sort of dish they put up? Is there any chance of you posting a photo of the dish?
 
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Steve Steve

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You could check the signal strength and Quallity on the channels.. that do work.....to see if it's a dish or LNb problem...
 

SatSap

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Thanks very much for your replies.

Sorry for being dull, but if the dish wasn't aligned correctly how is it that both the Sky boxes used by different installers picked up the missing channels? I am quite confused about this.

As for the dish photo, there's no way now to snap it from below as it is too high up and set low on the back of the chimney stack facing away from me so even hard to spot from the road. It's a small black mesh dish, but going by the first installer's work and his general lack of care (no drip loop coming into building, no dust sheets indoors when drilling, left mess on carpets etc) I would suggest it is likely to be the cheapest available dish and lnb available. Not much help I know. The second installer didn't say anything about the dish not being any good. The second lot are CAI registered - on their paperwork and website. The first bloke wasn't. Not that it really means much I suppose.

Could I really be that unlucky? To have two different installers in that don't know how to install a dish for freesat properly? The first bloke really got under my skin (just low standards), but I feel just as miffed at having paid the second installer (who was very polite and courteous btw) when he was supposed to move the dish to resolve the problem....which he didn't. So left me with the same problem as I had before they came and I ended up paying still. And I'm not one of those people that would refuse to pay...wish I was, but he moved the dish and he was telling me the dish was set up as it should be.
 
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With two installers setting it up I suspect not a signal issue. Does the Samsung do a blind scan? if not its database of Transponder frequencies might be a bit out of date and mean it is not finding stuff. Have you checked the transponder frequencies for the missing channels on something like Lyngsat and confirmed that the transponders are in the database of the Samsung TV. Now how you do the last part I don't know but hopefully it is in the manual.
 

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If it's the just channels listed above that are missing it seems to be a problem receiving two transponders:

11307 H and 11307 V.

It could be the LNB isn't skewed properly (although seems unlikely if it's just these two transponders) or some kind of local interference that the Sky boxes are able to ignore but the TV doesn't like or is generating internally. It's certainly an odd problem.
 

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Same frequency but both polarities ................ I wonder if it's a software problem whereby the tuner is confused? Very few other Freesat Transponders use split polarity like this.

Maybe worth Googling (Other Search Engines are available) to see if this or other Samsung Models have got an inherent issue.

From all the info given, it certainly seems to be Samsung related.
 

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Can you please post the model number, of the Samsung television.
If it has twin sat tuners try each cable, individually, in each tuner, one at a time, then see if the channels scan in.
I would also check Samsungs website for firmware updates, and do an internet search, as Tivu sugested.
 

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I agree with you, Tivu! It sounds like the Freesat tuner may be bad (never let it be said that they don't go faulty).
 

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Well the search phrase samsung freesat tv problem missing channels throws up much interesting reading.
 

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Can you edit the transponder frequencies??

Ive seen odd effects on a few receivers where the frequencies are the same but on opposite polarities. - the second scan blats the original channels!

If so change one to 11306 & the other to 11308 (dont worry they will still work).



ANother possibility is that the lnb isnt set up optimally to reject the cross polarity interference.
 

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Hello Thanks again.

The TV is a Samsung UE46F8000.

I unscrewed first cable from the back of the tv and the tv doesn't find anything without the first f plug connected and the second plug connected (second freesat is called sat sub, first is sat main.) So I then connected the first plug again and disconnected the second and set the scan parameter to single instead of dual and scanned again. No joy. I then disconnected the cable and connected the other side of the shotgun cable to sat main and rescanned but still same problem. I then reconnected both cables and rescanned and still same problem.

You cannot change the Satellite when scanning for freesat...the satellite list is greyed out. However, the transponders list is under LNB settings - I found after hunting high and low (not in e-manual) - and you can select satellite and transponder under the LNB settings after scanning. When I select Eutelsat 28.5 (there's Eutelsat 28.5 and Astra 28.2 in the drop down list) for the satellite and then choose either of the 11307 transponders the signal bar drops to 0%. When I choose the original transponder it goes back up to 80%ish. There is a custom transponder field and I added a user setting first for 11306 & then 11308 and selected them but 0% signal when selected.

Sorry if this is gobbledeegook. All this is completely new to me.
 

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Tha suggest to me your dish isnt quite aligned properly, or theres a tree branch (or similar) hanging into its line of sight just enough to kill the slightly weaker signals from Eutelsat 28A (the two 11307 tp's are carried on the elderly 28A).
 

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I have the same TV but have to admit I have never tried the built in sat tuners, I can test them at the weekend if it helps.
What I would suggest though is making sure you have the latest firmware as suggest above, just connect the TV wired or wireless to your network and navigate to the software update menu.
 

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Tha suggest to me your dish isnt quite aligned properly, or theres a tree branch (or similar) hanging into its line of sight just enough to kill the slightly weaker signals from Eutelsat 28A (the two 11307 tp's are carried on the elderly 28A).
I'm not so sure it is the dish alignment, 11.222 H is probably the weakest transponder.
 

SatSap

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Hi, and thanks again.

Yes, that would be very helpful, thankyou.

Re firmware. Yes, the fw is the latest and up to date. Everything that can be is connected to a wired home network, upstairs and down so that side of things is taken care of. Couldn't see what had changed after it had updated it to be honest. Anyway.

If it turns out not to be the TV and is something in the way (like the edges of blocks of flats) then the satellite installers will need to be convinced...unless they know already.

Can mobile phone masts affect satellite reception? Sorry if this is a dumb question. Just that there are 3 masts (different operators) on the flats behind our house which has always been a bit controversial here. Grasping at straws probably. Just don't want to pay another installer to do it as I've paid twice already. I need to convince the last one that it needs sorting.

edit---
Just to respond because I posted at the same time as the last post, 11.222 is 22% on the signal bar
 

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22% seems very low. What are other frequencies like?
 
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