Help .... Hotel Installation

[yorkjo]

I have previously only installed single systems. I have been asked to install a multi room system in a hotel.
The building already has single coax to each room.

They want free-to air channels, just one news channel for each language, French, German, Italian, English and to continue with their current Nova selection.

My initial idea was to fit another dish with multiple LNB. Cable to a receiver set to the specific required channel. Cable from each receiver to the current fitted distribution panels. Set individual room TV's channel list to include not only current Nova selection but also nominated foreign News channels.

My question is would this simple answer work as per owners wishes.

Would I need to install amplifiers after each individual receiver. Are there any other perceived problems?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks.

 

[Analoguesat]

Anything to do with multi room hotel installation is well outside the scope of this forum. You might get some general help, but dont expect any detailed help.

 

[Channel Hopper]

. Are there any other perceived problems?

Lots, the most serious for you would be if the system failed, you would be responsible for whatever the hotel deems as losses until it is fixed.

I would not take the risk personally, but look to receive a finders commission from a company that could carry out the work on your behalf.

 

[Robbo]

Why do you want to fit multiple LNBs?

Nova is on Hotbird, and since you only want news channels, pretty sure you'll find what you need on there, inc BBC world news.

 

[smoggy07]

you can get everything off the existing satellite

(the french one is dvb-s2 but I`m sure there will be a dvb-s news channel on there)

What kind of system do they have in place at the moment, how are they delivering nova to the rooms?

 

[yorkjo]

Many thanks for the feedback. At the moment there is just Analogue local TV in each room so maybe smoggy07's suggestion of replacing that with Nova would be OK. Is there any problems with doing that using the existing cable runs?

 

[archive10]

Many thanks for the feedback. At the moment there is just Analogue local TV in each room so maybe smoggy07's suggestion of replacing that with Nova would be OK. Is there any problems with doing that using the existing cable runs?

There are many options, and solutions possible, so you need to level expectations with the hotel owners:

For example, you could stick an STB in each room, and just obtain a hotel-license for the installation from the content provider. This requires an STB in each room, SAT-compatible coax, and a large distribution switch (size depending on #rooms, LNBs etc). This is problematic as the STBs can get stolen, difficult to operate for novices, easy to screw up by hotel guests etc.

Or you can build a head-end with either STBs (bad idea), or professional IRDs (good idea, but more expensive), and distribute via analogue channels (like most hotels did 10-20 years ago). This is the simplest for guest, but also give crap quality. You can also use a professional QAMs & and SI-generator and stick digital TVs in each room; tihs is more expensive though. In both cases you still need redistribution rights for all signals except FTA (depends on legislation in Greece).

Third group of solutions is to have IRDs and redistribute via IP over coax to (professional) IPTV stb. This is what is used in most upgrades to modern hotel TV installations where the only connection to hotel rooms is the existing coax. This allows for full interactivity, as found with hotel TVs etc.

And there are many more.
Essentially, the key questions are:
- how many rooms?
- what's the budget?
- what quality is acceptable? (Is this mom-and-pop operation, or 200 room resort?)
- who will support the installation when problems occur, and is the hotel prepared to have a service agreement?

 

[archive10]

Many thanks for the feedback. At the moment there is just Analogue local TV in each room so maybe smoggy07's suggestion of replacing that with Nova would be OK. Is there any problems with doing that using the existing cable runs?

You specific question: This depends on what you are going to distribute to teach room. If you go for the option of putting an STB in each room, you must ensure that the cable is SAT grade (ie. without too much loss over 1 GHz). If you redistribute analogue TV, you can live with "normal" antenna cable.

Again, it depends on the questions in my previous reply.

 

[ralphmagno]

hello,
seting up a hotel is not that bad.
you will need a modulator(tv transmitter for each channel you want to send to the tv)
if you are not using greek locak broadcasting then the uhf band is free to use.
modulators are cheep. they run less that 50 euro each and can be tunes from ch 21 470 mhz to ch 67 870 mhz.

if you start with channel 21 skip one and the next modulator will be ch .23. then ch 25 then 27 then ch 29 etc
each modulator has a level adjust, some can be looped to each other and some can go to a mixer/splitter.
you will then have to sent this to a amplifier and can sent 20 to 30 tv channels to the hotel .
you will need a satellite receiver for each channel received as well. so 20 satellite receiver and 20 modulators.

you will need satellite dishes pointing to the sats you want to receive.
and make sure tha all satellite receivers will turn on after a power outage.
if the power is anything like italy the boxes will reset back on when the power comes up.

if you are receiving from 2 satellite possions then you would need a 8 input 24 out multiswitch for 2 satellite possions.
they make 12 in and 24 out as well.
if you need any more information i check here all the time
ralph

 

[rolfw]

Pushing your luck with that Ralph, as you cannot ignore the taboo channels when using cheap DSB modulators, you cannot use any analogue channel spaced 1,5 or 9 above or below an analogue channel that is in use due to secondary harmonics.

 

[archive10]

What our friend Ralph writes is very true - you can set it up this way.
You do, however, need to consider maintenance.
If you use cheap, consumer-grade equipment, you must consider the price of fixing problems.
The larger the installation, the more often something will fail.
So you need to calculate either margin in your price for regular support (swapping of failed items), or have a good call-out service contract.

Among other things, we install hotel TV systems for 200+ room installations.
Ideally we install IPTV systems using STBs (with no moving parts) attached to the back of the displays (hotel TVs).
The service contract is written to ensure a service-level-agreement that guarantees a maximum response time to failures.
We generally only use equipment that have a (proven) low failure rate - else we have to write specific support agreements with the equipment providers.

We did one (adventurous) installation using Windows Media PCs as clients some years ago - big mistake. The cost of supporting the hotel with software updates, anti-virus software, fans failing etc was massive. We ended up swapping the whole system with a made-for-hotels IPTV based system in its entirety, as this was much cheaper for us, hotel, and therethrough eventually the hotel guests...

(And if you do IP based systems you can remote diagnose things easily, although I have the feeling that this is perhaps not what you are looking for. I have the hunch you want a simple low-maintenance system. The analogoue re-dist is probably more along what you need, but do consider professional gear designed to be on 24/7. There are some low-cost options available).

 

[archive10]

...just realized this thread has "Domestic Only" in it's title.
Perhaps we should have another thread or section to discuss this sort of thing??

 

[ralphmagno]

hello to all,
i have had to do minium maitance on a turk build with 60 appatrments.
it runs 20 channel from a elecrronics company called tron in turkey.
these cheep modulators run 24/7 and never failed.
all they want is to watch tv and thats all.
now they will be adding another 20 tv channels.
no computer driven anything.
ralph

 

[PaulR]

The title is "Domestic only" to discourage semi-professional (or even professionals ;)) from quoting or starting a job that they are really not qualified for. Whilst we have no objection to general enquiries we cannot offer full backup - this is not a help desk. We don't offer service level agreements. And we don't guarantee to have an answer.

Besides if someone feels that they can get the answers here there might even be a legal comeback - this is a hobby forum after all.

 

[Topper]

Besides if someone feels that they can get the answers here there might even be a legal comeback - this is a hobby forum after all.

Missed this thread in my haste yesterday, yes Paul you are quite correct this is a hobbyists forum and such installations are beyond the knowledge and scope of most hobbyists, again I would stress that any advice taken is at the members risk.

 

[yorkjo]

I appreciate the sentiments regarding 'Domestic only'. Having only fitted domestic TV and satellite systems before and living on a small island with no other accessible venues for advice I posed the question on this forum. The advice I have received has gone far beyond my expectations for this I thank you. It will enable me to proceed infinitely more informed than previously. Any work carried out here at the moment is fraught with difficulties regarding costs against clients expectations. Many thanks.

 

[archive10]

I appreciate the sentiments regarding 'Domestic only'. Having only fitted domestic TV and satellite systems before and living on a small island with no other accessible venues for advice I posed the question on this forum.

Yorkjo, you did nothing wrong posing the question (I think, anyway ). You can ask any question you like - it's just how you can interpret and rely on the answers (or lack thereof had there been none). As Ralph describes it you can get away with something that very much resembles a hobbyists set-up, so not too far off the mark.

 

[archive10]

Just spent some time in Ehiopia - it turns out that just about all hotels and guest houses (save the Hilton league) has a single dish or two, then a cupboard with 6-8 receivers with RF output attached to an 8-way combiner and a simple cable TV distribution network.
Much like Ralph suggests, but perhaps even simpler.

The downsides were quite obvious however,
- channels changed randomly as someone with the key to the cupboard changed channel on the recievers.
- in-room tvs had many many "static-channels".
- Quality is crap.

But it's fairly cheap, and works reasonably well.

 

[Channel Hopper]

Just spent some time in Ehiopia - .

Which is nowhere near Greece.