Which Skybox for low-fringe Lefkosia,Cyprus?

[bignick]

Iceman vs BigNick --- The Challenge

.................

Thank you BigNick too for stimulating the topic. Next time BigNick is in Cyprus, the drinks are on me.

.................

If I had to turn the clock back 18 months, this is what I would have done:
1. Become a member of the Satellites.co.uk
2. Seek help and probably end-up with an offset high gain type dish and a good LNB.

Goodbye.

Thanks for the statment in Bold ....now, everytime I read 'backround music' in this thread the words to 'eye of the tiger are in my mind'...and damn it I can't get them out!! !

BTW the challenge is still on (live do in Cyprus Leftiris, only an hour or so from you)

As for the turning the clock back...I couldn't agree more with point 1....
Point 2 (And armed with my patent "Can o' worms opener") I would say that up to 2m dishes the offsets are best. 2m-2.4m is something of a grey area - I personally would have a Famaval over either the anderson or the Supral, but rate the 2.4m DH Prime maybe not quite so good. And as for the 2.5m Prime that we all know and love in these parts - I wouldn't touch them or their larger cousins with a 20ft barge pole! - You all know the one I mean ;) . Over 2.4m...Prime Focus every time.

I like Prime focus Dishes. You loose a little because of the shadow caused by the LNB, But you can do more with the LNBs & especially the new style Feedhorns to help. Though I appreciate that the similar setup with the C120 Lnbs on offsets are also very effective.

Leftiris .... At about 1600hrs when the backround EPG is good, try flicking up and down between 411 & 410 They might be weak then. If the signal to these channels is good then it will be ok, if not then the box may lock up.

Iceman ... What was the make of his 2.4m? And so I know what to ask Future for, what is the make of your offest dish?

Cheers

Nick

 

[iceman]

Iceman ... What was the make of his 2.4m? And so I know what to ask Future for, what is the make of your offest dish?

I have no idea what make the dish 2.4m dish was M8....I am not used to working on prime focus dishes under 3.0m...first time i saw one of these..
One thing i did not like about the dish was the fact that the three LNB support arms being too close to each other in the center of the dish..doesn't do much good to the signal reflected from the dish..

1.8m offset dish i use is made by a company called Azure Shine http://www.azureshine.com.tw/main-180cm.htm
I believe Future in Limassol sell them..
I get the best result from this dish when i use Sharp 0.3dB LNBF (white case BS1R6EL100W)....believe it or not this LNBF is better than invacom or anything else on the market;)

 

[bignick]

believe it or not this LNBF is better than invacom or anything else on the market;)

I can beleive that no probs m8 ...the Invacom universal becomes quite inefficent on dishes over 1.6m.

Have you tried it with a c120 invacom and the 'special' feedhorn for offsets?

Cheers

Nick

 

[iceman]

Have you tried it with a c120 invacom and the 'special' feedhorn for offsets?

I have tried the C120 quad invacom with the "special" + about 6-7 other feeds designed for offsets (including chaparal/SMW etc.etc.)....Nothing comes close to Sharp 0.3dB LNBF on large offset dishes i tested..;)

 

[Zorba]

Did you get any bbc/itv at all on lefty's dish?
2 other lnb's that i like to use on prime focus dishes to improve ch4/eurosports etc are Strong and that small Inverto.works everytime when i replace worn out lnbs on 2.4m famavals.When i work on 2.7s then its always Invacom because of bbc.
Ps can you confirm it was a 2.7 because i have been to customers who have been "misled" and found 2.4 or 2.5

 

[iceman]

Ps can you confirm it was a 2.7 because i have been to customers who have been "misled" and found 2.4 or 2.5

Definately not a 2.7m M8....looked more like a 2.4m to me...as you say people are usually misled about the size of their dish...
No BBC or ITV ofcourse.

 

[Zorba]

I thought so.have you dealt with DH or Famaval before?
The DH is beige with three thick alumnium lnb struts and the Famaval is grey with three black thinner struts slightly angled at dish end.

 

[iceman]

I have not dealt with either DH or Framaval before M8...This dish was beige with as you say thick LNB struts very close to the center of the dish...also it had four adjustable arms supporting the dish from the rear..

 

[Zorba]

Sounds like a DH 2.4,thats a shame then.If it were a Famaval it could have been extended,a favourite of bignicks
;)

 

[bignick]

Sounds like a DH 2.4,thats a shame then.If it were a Famaval it could have been extended,a favourite of bignicks
;)

Mmmmmmmmmmmmm ......... Famaval

....Think I was a bit unfair on the old DH though...you get more DH for your buck. I find that when buying new the 2.7m DH is about the same as the 2.4m Fami ... makes it a bit of a no brainer for Paphos.

 

[Zorba]

Stop drooling. Did you know that the Famaval is actually 2.3m?

 

[Red Hugh]

Possibly the best/nicest Verbal/Type(d) punchup, I've seen/read in years.
Some very valid points made clear to all interested parties.

I recently disposed of about a dozen second user panny 30's and as always, tested samebefore selling on.
Tests were carried out on a constant signal strength/quality via meter from 60cm dish 95%.

Panny's varied from about 60-95% on both strength/quality.
The panny that came in at 60%, was situated on top of a VCR & under a DVD player, in my mates house. been slowly cooked over the years.

I am using 3 faultless panny's in different rooms,

So my penny's worth is, what conditions has the panny got to put up with?
Also since the BBC moved to Astra's much smaller 2D footprint, this must have had an adverse affect on reception in areas further afield.

 

[Lefteris]

Did you get any bbc/itv at all on lefty's dish?
2 other lnb's that i like to use on prime focus dishes to improve ch4/eurosports etc are Strong and that small Inverto.works everytime when i replace worn out lnbs on 2.4m famavals.When i work on 2.7s then its always Invacom because of bbc.
Ps can you confirm it was a 2.7 because i have been to customers who have been "misled" and found 2.4 or 2.5

I paid for a 2.7 metre and now i found tha they installed me a 2.4 metre. Call me stupid but I never went to the roof to measure it!

When I was living in Athens I had a TRIAX offset 1.1m and there were no lock ups. When we moved to Lefkosia, I knew nothing about reception requirements and I hired a local sat-man to do what it was necessary. I had told him at the time that I had seen dishes which looked around 3.0 metres, but the man had told me that he could do it at 2.7 without bother.

I did not suspect anything, since for several months the system was OK and the background music at the time could be heard perfect. It is a mystery as to what happened and it has been deteriorated to almost a point of no return.

I still have not measured it and I believe Iceman's opinion that it is a 2.4 metre. Bottom line I was tricked. ... and in case you ask, I got no receipt stating the actual size ... I will not name his shop in this forum.

 

[Lefteris]

Possibly the best/nicest Verbal/Type(d) punchup, I've seen/read in years.
Some very valid points made clear to all interested parties.
............
So my penny's worth is, what conditions has the panny got to put up with?
.....

Regarding the conditions which the Panny was exposed to, here is the feedback.

In the begininning when I was experiencing no lock ups, the Panny 30 was inside a cabinet with glass doors and a few holes at the back. There was a 4-5 cm top clearance. Now I recollect that at the time the usnit was etting hot on the top and so (fearing that I could loose it) everytim I was watching SKY, the glass doors were slightly opened. But my missus and kids were not so caring and kept it closed most of the times. I do not know whether overheating had an effect on the lock ups which started a few months after the dish installation.

Now the panny is sitting on its own in an open space and its top side temperature appears to exhibit less heat than before, which Iceman thought it was normal temperature for such unit.

I am more inclined to say that the gradual loss of background music and the lock ups which became more frequent may also have some relation to the software, which at the time was older version. Now it has software version 3.5 and it works.

The moral of the story (and I would agree with you) is do not throw away your Panny even when lock ups start. Instead research why it locks ups. Thanks to Iceman, I kept the old Panny 30 and can still watch the channels without lock-ups anymore.

 

[Lefteris]

Leftiris .... At about 1600hrs when the backround EPG is good, try flicking up and down between 411 & 410 They might be weak then. If the signal to these channels is good then it will be ok, if not then the box may lock up.
... Nick

Hi Nick,

I hurried back from office and carried out the test above at 16.30 SKY UK time. The signal strength was about 45% and the signal quality about 20%. I flicked between 411 and 410 without bother. Perhaps the signal was too good since the background music could now be received without crackling at all.

Cheers - Lefteris

 

[bignick]

Hi Nick,

I hurried back from office and carried out the test above at 16.30 SKY UK time. The signal strength was about 45% and the signal quality about 20%. I flicked between 411 and 410 without bother. Perhaps the signal was too good since the background music could now be received without crackling at all.

Cheers - Lefteris

Its hard to tell because I'm not sure of the area and not even certain of the dish, but were the 2 channels I mention 410 & 411 eurosports channels clear at this time? If they are clear then the panni won't lock! These two channels maybe weaker than 11778, therefore what I am trying to prove is that DSB lockups are as a result of trying to 'channel hop' to weak channels rather than in some way being linked to the strength of the default transponder. Keep an eye on these channels and any of the other weaker ones such as sky3, hallmark, paramount 2, and scifi+1....if you if the box is taking a while to 'make up its mind' or when the channel does come in, it is heavily pixelating, then try channel shifting up and down to see if the box locks.

Any chance of posting a piccy of the front and rear of the dish?

Cheers

Nick

 

[bignick]

Just so you can gauge the history of the problem and my interest in the subject, here is a thead I started just over two years ago on the DS forum (before I knew about this forum). Admin:-worship : Apologies if I've broken any rules by doing this, but it is relivent to the discussion

_http://forum.digitalspy.co.uk/board/showthread.php?t=128719

Please note the various places that the problem rears its head.

Cheers

Nick

 

[rolfw]

No problem, as long as the link isn't parsed.

 

[iceman]

Nick
Here's some links to threads dating back as far as 18 months...I had adressed the issue and posted that the freezing pannys were working OK on larger dishes
I was just not sure which transponder it was that was kicking them back to life..

http://www.satellites.co.uk/php-bin/forum/showthread.php?t=36911
http://www.satellites.co.uk/php-bin/forum/showthread.php?t=39896
http://www.satellites.co.uk/php-bin/forum/showthread.php?t=44207

 

[bignick]

Nick
Here's some links to threads dating back as far as 18 months...I had adressed the issue and posted that the freezing pannys were working OK on larger dishes
I was just not sure which transponder it was that was kicking them back to life..

http://www.satellites.co.uk/php-bin/forum/showthread.php?t=36911
http://www.satellites.co.uk/php-bin/forum/showthread.php?t=39896
http://www.satellites.co.uk/php-bin/forum/showthread.php?t=44207

Its certainly been a talked about subject!!!

My personal opinion is that its coincidence about the transponder...you have two very distinct sizes of dish that you use:

The 4.2 is big enough to bring in 11778 all the time, but it also brings in everything else all the time so clear picture on all channels = no lock ups

Your smaller offset dish is nowhere near big enough to bring in the astra 2d stuff, therefore it is tuned for everything else which it brings in ok = no lock ups.

Now, you've probably had experiences with loads of 1.5-1.8m dishes which WILL cause lock ups but will also NOT bring in 11778, hence your perfectly reasonable arguement about the default transponder thing - but it also makes my auguement about weak channels :-Nooo

I have personally never made any connection with lock ups and the default transponder, I think it is just a weak channel thing & it just so happens that, because of our geographical location, and the way that 11778 comes in compared to the other frequencies that it makes your point. I think that there are times that out in cyprus you can have lock ups when 11778 is present (EG BBC on a 2.4m dish in SW Cyprus), but to really make the point you need to check out areas where 11778 is really strong all the time but its other channels that come in and out! (anyone out there......)

Damn it, I WILL have my Efes:-beer

Cheers

Nick