Feeds from Qatar?

Channel Hopper

Suffering fools, so you don't have to.
Staff member
Joined
Jan 1, 2000
Messages
35,613
Reaction score
8,581
Points
113
Age
59
Website
www.sat-elite.uk
My Satellite Setup
A little less analogue, and a lot more crap.
My Location
UK
Reported by stanley_cassidy on 2022-11-22 05:32 pm
ligne570.gif
fleche.gif
Eutelsat 10A (10.0°E)
defaut-en.gif
ligne415_verte.gif
Frequency: 12733 - Pol: V - SR: 6666 - FEC: -
ligne415_verte.gif
Category: Sport - Football
ligne415_verte.gif
Transmitted in: MPEG-4
ligne415_verte.gif
ℹ About FIFA World Cup

ligne570_verte.gif
 

Criptex

New Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2022
Messages
5
Reaction score
4
Points
3
Age
34
My Satellite Setup
1.2 m Dish with Universal Ku LNB.
My Location
Africa
Unfortunately there are no feeds for this world cup. All feeds mentioned are either a fixed camera outside the stadium or a camera showing fans. The 21.5e feed is the feed of the terrestrial moroccan channel. The EBIF feeds are most probably ns4.
 

7mdish

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
549
Reaction score
226
Points
43
My Satellite Setup
CM 2.4m motorised offset dish, Viking Ku-band 2-ports motorised feed, 2 SMW LNBs, RC2000A, Dreambox DM920.
My Location
Milan, Italy
Yes I'm agree. No feeds yet.
Only some fixed camera and maybe occasional unilateral feed for some broadcaster, but no main feeds for live matches.
 

mapperuo

Specialist Contributor
Joined
Aug 16, 2012
Messages
1,065
Reaction score
1,135
Points
113
Age
32
Location
Fife, Scotland
My Satellite Setup
2x 1.8m Raven
1.5m Gibby
2x 1.2m Gibby
My Location
Fife, Scotland
There was a UHD 4:2:2 30000 SR test feed of stadium mix a few days ago but I imagine that was just like a disaster recovery test and as you say it's over fibre the main feed.

Or they meant to uplink it in NS4 and forgot...
 

Criptex

New Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2022
Messages
5
Reaction score
4
Points
3
Age
34
My Satellite Setup
1.2 m Dish with Universal Ku LNB.
My Location
Africa
Yes that 4:2:2 feed was on 10e .And of course the main feed is over fiber. FOX Sports has just installed two 100 gbps links there with its set on qatar for feed transmission but all the feeds must also have a satellite backup.
Maybe someone here with novelsat equipment carries a scan on eutelsat 7e and 10e i guess European uplinks are there.
 

7mdish

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
549
Reaction score
226
Points
43
My Satellite Setup
CM 2.4m motorised offset dish, Viking Ku-band 2-ports motorised feed, 2 SMW LNBs, RC2000A, Dreambox DM920.
My Location
Milan, Italy
If it is NS4 maybe I could check in a few days, as soon as I have access to one Novelsat box, but I don't know exactly if and when it will be.
 

Criptex

New Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2022
Messages
5
Reaction score
4
Points
3
Age
34
My Satellite Setup
1.2 m Dish with Universal Ku LNB.
My Location
Africa
Maybe, but i think there is a conventional way for feeds broadcasting for example EBU has a permanent satellite multiplex for its feeds all on ns4 and on specific satellites based on coverage. 10e,7e,3e for Europe and mena, 122e,100.5e,76.5e for asia and 47.5w,55.5w for americas.
Confirming this i have already seen 2 ns4 feeds for this world cup. One on 55.5w and the other on asiasat 122e,100.5e.
 

7mdish

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
549
Reaction score
226
Points
43
My Satellite Setup
CM 2.4m motorised offset dish, Viking Ku-band 2-ports motorised feed, 2 SMW LNBs, RC2000A, Dreambox DM920.
My Location
Milan, Italy
Maybe used non-GEO satellites
I don't think so, not at all. No TV feeds are distributed through non-GEO satellites from many many years, probably from the Seventies.
Also, I do not believe there is any satellite out of GEO sending TV channels.
 

mind.hunter

New Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2022
Messages
1
Reaction score
0
Points
1
Age
34
My Satellite Setup
TBS 8922

7.0E to 119.5E
My Location
Saturn
A Sports on 38.5E is fastest than feeds.
 

moonbase

Small Dish Man
Joined
Mar 29, 2004
Messages
4,373
Reaction score
4,479
Points
113
My Satellite Setup
.
My Location
UK
... EBU has a permanent satellite multiplex for its feeds all on ns4 and on specific satellites based on coverage. 10e,7e,3e for Europe and mena, ...


Interesting, I have not bothered to scan 3.1E for NS3/NS4 feeds.

I currently have a 2.0m dish on 3.1E setup for C-Band. When I refit the Ku feed assembly I will have a scan to see if I can find anything.
If there are any NS3/NS4 feeds on the Europe beam from 3.1E I might have a chance of seeing them. If they are on the steerable or East beam I will have no chance.
 

Analoguesat

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Messages
50,798
Reaction score
11,253
Points
113
Location
Scottish Borders
My Satellite Setup
TM 5402HD
Sky+ UK.
My Location
Scottish Borders
A Sports on 38.5E is fastest than feeds.
It cant be - by definition a feed is a single hop, either via fibre or satellite, which takes x amount of time to travel to the host from the stadium. A satellite broadcaster ads a half second delay just from the round trip from the tv uplink to the satellite and back down to the satellite dish. Plus any delays added in by encryption, decryption, frame stores etc.
 

moonbase

Small Dish Man
Joined
Mar 29, 2004
Messages
4,373
Reaction score
4,479
Points
113
My Satellite Setup
.
My Location
UK
It cant be - by definition a feed is a single hop, either via fibre or satellite, which takes x amount of time to travel to the host from the stadium. A satellite broadcaster ads a half second delay just from the round trip from the tv uplink to the satellite and back down to the satellite dish. Plus any delays added in by encryption, decryption, frame stores etc.


With respect to the particular satellite TV channel in question (A Sports from 38.0E in C-Band) it is in fact faster than the Globecast feeds from 3.1E in C-Band that show the same content.
This comes about by the fact that the Globecast feeds of the World Cup soccer on 3.1E are second or third hop uplinks that are probably using fibre or NS3/NS4 as their original source.
The Globecast feeds are probably passed through various processing stages and studios before being uplinked to 3.1E for downlink into the African market.

Due to the signal path taken by the Globecast feeds with additional encoding and uplinking they turn out to be slower than a mainstream satellite TV channel.
I timed the difference in speed between these pictures myself using side by side TV's connected a C-Band multi dish setup.

This particular situation is an anomaly and only brought about by the fact that there are no other general satellite feeds in C-Band or Ku-Band for the World Cup soccer that show actual full duration live matches.
To the best on my knowledge, the second or third hop Globacast feeds are the only feeds located so far that shows entire duration live action of the matches.

In the pure definition of a raw feed, provided it is a single path direct uplink/downlink and "untampered" with by the uplink van crew then it is impossible for a mainstream satellite TV channel to have faster pictures of the same content.
 
Last edited:

Channel Hopper

Suffering fools, so you don't have to.
Staff member
Joined
Jan 1, 2000
Messages
35,613
Reaction score
8,581
Points
113
Age
59
Website
www.sat-elite.uk
My Satellite Setup
A little less analogue, and a lot more crap.
My Location
UK
I don't think so, not at all. No TV feeds are distributed through non-GEO satellites from many many years, probably from the Seventies.
Also, I do not believe there is any satellite out of GEO sending TV channels.
An inclined orbit bird can be categorised as a 'non GEO' (all 'stationary' satellites up there are effectively non GEO since they all wobble above and below the orbital altitude to a greater or lesser extent).
 

Analoguesat

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Messages
50,798
Reaction score
11,253
Points
113
Location
Scottish Borders
My Satellite Setup
TM 5402HD
Sky+ UK.
My Location
Scottish Borders
With respect to the particular satellite TV channel in question (A Sports from 38.0E in C-Band) it is in fact faster than the Globecast feeds from 3.1E in C-Band that show the same content.
This comes about by the fact that the Globecast feeds of the World Cup soccer on 3.1E are second or third hop uplinks that are probably using fibre or NS3/NS4 as their original source.
The Globecast feeds are probably passed through various processing stages and studios before being uplinked to 3.1E for downlink into the African market.

Due to the signal path taken by the Globecast feeds with additional encoding and uplinking they turn out to be slower than a mainstream satellite TV channel.
I timed the difference in speed between these pictures myself using side by side TV's connected a C-Band multi dish setup.

This particular situation is an anomaly and only brought about by the fact that there are no other general satellite feeds in C-Band or Ku-Band for the World Cup soccer that show actual full duration live matches.
To the best on my knowledge, the second or third hop Globacast feeds are the only feeds located so far that shows entire duration live action of the matches.

In the pure definition of a raw feed, provided it is a single path direct uplink/downlink and "untampered" with by the uplink van crew then it is impossible for a mainstream satellite TV channel to have faster pictures of the same content.
@moonbase Wow thank you for that explanation - a fascinating and exceedingly rare quirk.
 

7mdish

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
549
Reaction score
226
Points
43
My Satellite Setup
CM 2.4m motorised offset dish, Viking Ku-band 2-ports motorised feed, 2 SMW LNBs, RC2000A, Dreambox DM920.
My Location
Milan, Italy
An inclined orbit bird can be categorised as a 'non GEO' (all 'stationary' satellites up there are effectively non GEO since they all wobble above and below the orbital altitude to a greater or lesser extent).
Yes I agree. Mentioning non-GEO satellites I thought to those old (very old....) "moving" birds not fixed by perspective of terrestrial viewers.
But it was a very very far era....
 

Criptex

New Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2022
Messages
5
Reaction score
4
Points
3
Age
34
My Satellite Setup
1.2 m Dish with Universal Ku LNB.
My Location
Africa
With respect to the particular satellite TV channel in question (A Sports from 38.0E in C-Band) it is in fact faster than the Globecast feeds from 3.1E in C-Band that show the same content.
This comes about by the fact that the Globecast feeds of the World Cup soccer on 3.1E are second or third hop uplinks that are probably using fibre or NS3/NS4 as their original source.
The Globecast feeds are probably passed through various processing stages and studios before being uplinked to 3.1E for downlink into the African market.

Due to the signal path taken by the Globecast feeds with additional encoding and uplinking they turn out to be slower than a mainstream satellite TV channel.
I timed the difference in speed between these pictures myself using side by side TV's connected a C-Band multi dish setup.

This particular situation is an anomaly and only brought about by the fact that there are no other general satellite feeds in C-Band or Ku-Band for the World Cup soccer that show actual full duration live matches.
To the best on my knowledge, the second or third hop Globacast feeds are the only feeds located so far that shows entire duration live action of the matches.

In the pure definition of a raw feed, provided it is a single path direct uplink/downlink and "untampered" with by the uplink van crew then it is impossible for a mainstream satellite TV channel to have faster pictures of the same content.
Hi @moonbase. The Globecast frequencies on 3.1e C Band with ID: NWTV PCO34 or GCF PCO35 are not feeds they are a re-broadcast of New World TV the right holder of the world cup in africa to other african authorised sub-licensees and has a delay of 30 seconds compared to other channels.
 

Analoguesat

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Messages
50,798
Reaction score
11,253
Points
113
Location
Scottish Borders
My Satellite Setup
TM 5402HD
Sky+ UK.
My Location
Scottish Borders
Yes I agree. Mentioning non-GEO satellites I thought to those old (very old....) "moving" birds not fixed by perspective of terrestrial viewers.
But it was a very very far era....
Used by the Russians to transmit programmes in UHFto remote corners of the USSR. They called them Molinya orbits.
 

moonbase

Small Dish Man
Joined
Mar 29, 2004
Messages
4,373
Reaction score
4,479
Points
113
My Satellite Setup
.
My Location
UK
Hi @moonbase. The Globecast frequencies on 3.1e C Band with ID: NWTV PCO34 or GCF PCO35 are not feeds they are a re-broadcast of New World TV the right holder of the world cup in africa to other african authorised sub-licensees and has a delay of 30 seconds compared to other channels.


@Criptex

Thank you for the explanation, I was not aware of the signal path.

Are you sure about the 30 second delay applied to these Globecast frequencies?
I tested 4 different sources of pictures, the list I prepared from testing is pasted below

1. A Sports on 38.0E (fastest)
2. M4 on 0.8W (about 0.6 secs slower than A Sports)
3. Globecast from 3.1E on 3727R (about 3.0 secs slower that A Sports)
4. BBC on 28.2E (about 6.7 secs slower than A Sports)

The slowest set of pictures was BBC UK at 6.7 seconds slower than A Sports from 38.0E.
Normally, if I test a BBC UK picture against a feed it is somewhere around 7 to 8 seconds slower than a feed, +/- any variation on the day.

If the Globecast frequencies from 3.1E were 30 seconds delayed I would have expected them to be at the bottom of my list with a large gap between them and the 3rd placed.
 
Top