Advice Needed Low Symbol Rate Dutch Radio feeds on 16°E

[Joolz]

Yes the the 5MHz bandwidth will depend on an SDR device that supports that rate. RTL-SDR (RTL2838) has a max bandwidth of 3.2MHz, but 2.4 or 2.8 is most stable.

The 5Mhz bandwidth is because I use a SDRPlay RSP2A and the available selection depends on the SDR type plugged in.

 

[s-band]

11054.28 H 176 DVB-S 1/2 with BNR was the only one of that group that wouldn't lock, just slightly too noisy still.

There are two other very narrow ones just above these as I think mentioned above with SR ~66 -

11055.00 H 66
11055.20 H 66

11054.173 locks OK but the 2 which are listed as 66ks/s lock at 68ks/s but I can't get any data. The frequencies are probably within about 100kHz but the system is not calibrated. Ignore 2 large, grey, panels on the captures. 1.2m dish with SMW Q-PLL LNB

I didn't get anywhere with the Amsat software, I don't know how I got it to lock in the past.

 

[s-band]

Here are some results on the upper band using a Minitiouner V2 with Minitioune V1.0.1.0r (beta). These were on a 1.2m dish with an SMW Q-PLL 11.3GHz LO. I have not calibrated the system for frequency.



There are many more signals around 12575H with SRs of 68, 121, 173, 362 and 416ks/s but none gave a full lock and they don't appear to be DVB.

 

[stephan94]

with TBS 6983 and IQMonitor
we find between 11051 and 11054 H four frequencies with very small SR and all are readable

 

[cirio70]

Sorry for the OT but:
Since i'm not a master in soldering small components, do you know where i can find a Minitiouner V2 ready to go?

Again sorry for the OT

 

[ozumo]

Sorry for the OT but:
Since i'm not a master in soldering small components, do you know where i can find a Minitiouner V2 ready to go?

Not exactly the same but works with the same software, also I think it still requires some soldering to complete it (LEDs & tuner ground)

https://boutique.r-e-f.org/kits-et-composants/281-minitiouner-s.html

I seem to remember if you aren't a member you have to email them for a quote.

Alternatively keep an eye on the BATC forum for-sale section.

 

[s-band]

@cirio70 There may be some old DATV Express modules on the used market and their new project looks very interesting : Home - DATV-Express digital-ATV project

 

[cirio70]

I couldn't resist so i bought a MiniTiouner V2 pro. What a little jewel!!!!



This is the spectrum scan around 11.055 H, it's almost identical to the one i obtained with iqmonitor but with IQMonitor it took me about 10 minutes, with MiniTiouner it took me 10 SECONDS!

Unfortunately i obtained the same result as @s-band : i couldn't lock the 2 low SR frequencies even if the signal is good so it should definitely be a different modulation....



Bye for now.. and thanks to @s-band who helped me with the software!

 

[EnoSat]

It's not quite about low SR, but what format do the Romanians use on 12718 for FM?

 

[ozumo]

The reason I asked is I'm using an RTL-SDR with DVB demod software on a laptop from Amsat DL that claims to lock both DVB-S and S2. Clearly it doesn't manage DVB-S.

Sorry for being a little off topic - I'm a bit late to the game but does everyone else find the Amsat DVB Demod GUI to be a bit random when it comes to locking DVB-S?

The S1 radio transponders around 11055H (except the two SR68 signals) will lock but not straight away. For example 11054.28 H 176 DVB-S 3/4 I got the constellation looking correct but only after going back and forth between an incorrect and correct symbol rate several times would it lock.

 

[SimonE]

Ozumo, I was having trouble myself with this program and wrote to the creator, Marcel. He made a video for me explaining how to undo those narrow s/r stations at 16E. http://v.1337team.tk/2023-01-09_18-29-18.mkv . See if that helps at all.... I hope the link still works for you. If not I do have it on my PC but its too large to add to this message SimonE

 

[ozumo]

Thanks for that, has certainly made locking them quicker. I still find that when the sync_confidence indicator gets tickled but doesn't rise to 32 changing the symbol rate to something wrong and back again will get it lock.

I'm still new to this so might just need a little more practice - on my first go it took me half an hour before realising Carrier Recovery needed to be ticked

 

[SimonE]

Ozumo, Marcel also wrote instructions in another email. See below:

i havent't really put a lot of effort into the DVB-S part, it's a bit

tricky. You have to set the correct FEC in the dropdown box, and then

click the 'Skip Symbol' button until the sync counter goes up. you also

need to rotate the constellation with the derotate slider. i haven't

implemented an auto-lock feature for DVB-S1.

Marcel

 

[satesco]

Ozumo, Marcel also wrote instructions in another email. See below:

i havent't really put a lot of effort into the DVB-S part, it's a bit

tricky. You have to set the correct FEC in the dropdown box, and then

click the 'Skip Symbol' button until the sync counter goes up. you also

need to rotate the constellation with the derotate slider. i haven't

implemented an auto-lock feature for DVB-S1.

Marcel

It would be good to tell him that the auto-lock feature for DVB-S1 is almost a Must because most muxes on satellite for stream radio have low symbol rates and are in QPSK mode. These parameters are favorable for the reception of these muxes, especially STV091X-based chip cards (6983/6903, USB5927).

 

[ozumo]

Conversely I would also like to have an option to manually tune S2 transponders or be able to limit some of the parameters. For weak signals where the parameters are known it can be difficult to catch the correct modcode and tick the S2_KEEP_LOCK box.

 

[SimonE]

Ozumo, I suggest you email Marcel. His email address appears when you run his program. Although he clearly has great skills to help us, his main interest is for DATV signals on Es'hails2

 

[EnoSat]

Eutelsat 21B at 21.5°E-TP DW 7 : Low Symbol Rates SR in satellite reception practice by author Roman Dávid | CZECH AND SLOVAK DX SATELLITE CLUB

Satellite distributions with a relatively Low Symbol Rate

www.dxsatcs.com

two unknown frequencies for DW7 transponder

 

[satesco]

At the moment i receive:
...

And nothing more

In high band:
12576.1 H - Joe ("SID 25599")
12576.6 H - Q music (named "Sid 21438")
12577.09 H - QNL AMS

Those in the upper band have been moved to 12566 H,12567 H, and 12568 H.

 

[cirio70]

I can confirm the @satesco find

12567.3 H 405 -> JOE
12567.8 H 405 -> Q Music
12568.3 H 495 -> QNL AMS

Fun Fact: every station broadcasts RDS data in a separate PID (i.e. JOE on PID 112) between a lot of garbage.

I discovered another possible station on 12565.7 H (possible SR 136) but i can't manage to lock it.

 

[cirio70]

In the lower band i can tune:

11053.3 H 355 -> SLAM! + 100% NL
11054.3 H 355 -> BNR AMS
11054.6 H 355 -> JOE TNZ + Radio538 TNZ

No luck for the other nearby freqs: