Advice Needed Motorized dish with one position dish.

Haa-sat

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Hello! I have maybe a difficult question.

I have a motorized dish and a one position dish. I would when the big dish are moved, should the little dish take over the reception for pay TV. And when I move the dish back to satellite position the big dish takes over the reception or works together with the little. I would the little dish take over reception to avoid disturbing recording and TV reception on they other receivers. I can maybe only use the little dish for pay TV, but because bad weather like snow, rain or wind can maybe make the little dish lose reception. I have only space for the little dish beside the big dish with a motor. Both of these dishes have good reception as it can be. I have tried with a 4x1 DISEQC switch, but it would only work with one dish and will never change to the other dish or work at the same time.

The question is what I can use instead of the DISEQC switch or other solutions?LNB switch.png
 

ozumo

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Replace the existing DiSEqC switch with a manual A/B switch.

Or depending on the capabilities of the pay-tv receivers, a DiSEqC switch for the each of the 3 receivers (plus another if the PVR has a second tuner) and another splitter for the signal from the 100cm dish. If the pay-tv receivers can't use DiSEqC then it won't work.

Small dish -> splitter 1 -> DiSEqC switches port 1
100cm dish -> splitter 2 -> DiSEqC switches port 2

The three receivers could then use either dish independently.
 

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Now, you seem to want to keep using the Unicable/JESS/DCSS mode of the LNBs?
That complicates your question a lot. (For a legacy setup, this would be quite manageable..)

Unicable multifeed is done parallel, so the "switching" is done in the LNBs themselves: they recognize that a receiver command is for them, or for the other LNB(s). So your LNBs must be programmed for that. And your receivers must be able to address both LNBs.

Unicable also isn't meant for a motorized setup.

This means that there are boundaries, to what you seem to want. You must, I guess, choose what use you want of your setup, in view of those boundaries. Then the setup would follow. For instance, you might need at least one extra cable between dishes and home...

greetz,
A33

Edit. By the way, the 4-way splitter seems to have powerpass both ways? There is no indication of power pass one way, as I would use/expect for (simultanuous) 4 receiver Unicable use!
But the text/power-lines on the splitter housing might not represent what is inside the splitter. You'd have to measures if diodes are in there, or not.
 
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Terryl

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Your also going to loose 12 dB of signal with a 4 way splitter, this may be too much loss for the system.
 

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Your also going to loose 12 dB of signal with a 4 way splitter, this may be too much loss for the system.

I think much less, 7 to 8 dB signal strength loss for a 4way I'd say.
See e.g.: https://support.channelmaster.com/h...-I-Lose-Using-a-Splitter-CM-3212HD-CM-3213HD-

But loss of signal strength is not critical, and from what I understand of Unicable/JESS/dCSS LNBs, they have a big signal strength, as they are of course meant to be used with splitters.
So I don't see a great risk, here.

Greetz,
A33
 

Haa-sat

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Replace the existing DiSEqC switch with a manual A/B switch.

Or depending on the capabilities of the pay-tv receivers, a DiSEqC switch for the each of the 3 receivers (plus another if the PVR has a second tuner) and another splitter for the signal from the 100cm dish. If the pay-tv receivers can't use DiSEqC then it won't work.

Small dish -> splitter 1 -> DiSEqC switches port 1
100cm dish -> splitter 2 -> DiSEqC switches port 2

The three receivers could then use either dish independently.
I survey with the tv distrubutor and I found out the pay TV receiver doesen't suport DISEQC. I think follow your suggestion to use A/B switch. If I use junction splitter/combiner will maybe transponders and frequencies disturb each other when two different satellites receives?
 

Haa-sat

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Now, you seem to want to keep using the Unicable/JESS/DCSS mode of the LNBs?
That complicates your question a lot. (For a legacy setup, this would be quite manageable..)

Unicable multifeed is done parallel, so the "switching" is done in the LNBs themselves: they recognize that a receiver command is for them, or for the other LNB(s). So your LNBs must be programmed for that. And your receivers must be able to address both LNBs.

Unicable also isn't meant for a motorized setup.

This means that there are boundaries, to what you seem to want. You must, I guess, choose what use you want of your setup, in view of those boundaries. Then the setup would follow. For instance, you might need at least one extra cable between dishes and home...

greetz,
A33

Edit. By the way, the 4-way splitter seems to have powerpass both ways? There is no indication of power pass one way, as I would use/expect for (simultanuous) 4 receiver Unicable use!
But the text/power-lines on the splitter housing might not represent what is inside the splitter. You'd have to measures if diodes are in there, or not.
Yes i will keep using DCSS mode. I use a SCR Unicable DCSS LNB and have two Legacy (universal) outputs and only motor use Leagacy. Maybe A/B switch is the best way to solve the problem. If i use one more extra cable how would it solve the problem and how would the setup look like? I can maybe replace the splitter to see if it will work better. I servey the splitter have power pass all outputs.
 

ozumo

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I survey with the tv distrubutor and I found out the pay TV receiver doesen't suport DISEQC. I think follow your suggestion to use A/B switch. If I use junction splitter/combiner will maybe transponders and frequencies disturb each other when two different satellites receives?
The A/B switch replaces the DiSEqC switch in your image. The switch only allows the signal from one LNB to pass at a time and all three receivers will be connected to the same dish. When the switch is pressed it is likely the receivers will display 'no signal' or similar, switching to a channel that is on a different transponder should restore signal, rebooting the receiver should also work.
 

Terryl

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I think much less, 7 to 8 dB signal strength loss for a 4way I'd say.
See e.g.: https://support.channelmaster.com/h...-I-Lose-Using-a-Splitter-CM-3212HD-CM-3213HD-

But loss of signal strength is not critical, and from what I understand of Unicable/JESS/dCSS LNBs, they have a big signal strength, as they are of course meant to be used with splitters.
So I don't see a great risk, here.

Greetz,
A33
3 dB per port, 4-way = 12dB, remember your dividing the incoming signal 4 ways, 3 dB is one half of your RF voltage. You also have to factor in the coax and connector loss.
 

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3 dB per port, 4-way = 12dB, remember your dividing the incoming signal 4 ways, 3 dB is one half of your RF voltage. You also have to factor in the coax and connector loss.
Eh ?

A double divide (ie x4) is a 6dB signal before connector losses.

Cater for about 8dB on each port.
 

Terryl

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Yup, I guess they are making them better than in my time.
 

Haa-sat

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Bytt ut den eksisterende DiSEqC-bryteren med en manuell A/B-bryter.

Eller avhengig av mulighetene til betal-tv-mottakerne, en DiSEqC-bryter for hver av de 3 mottakerne (pluss en annen hvis PVR har en andre tuner) og en annen splitter for signalet fra 100 cm-parabolen. Hvis betal-tv-mottakerne ikke kan bruke DiSEqC, vil det ikke fungere.

Liten parabol -> splitter 1 -> DiSEqC bytter port 1
100 cm tallerken -> splitter 2 -> DiSEqC bryter port 2

De tre mottakerne kunne deretter bruke begge parabolene uavhengig av hverandre.
If it will work with DISEQC, you mean the setup is like the picture?DISEQC Splitter.png
 

ozumo

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If it will work with DISEQC, you mean the setup is like the picture?
Yes, to change dishes you'd need to change a setting or have a second set of channels saved to a separate position on the receiver. If the pay-tv receivers don't have DiSEqC options then it wouldn't work either way.

The best solution would be a larger dish.
 

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If the pay-tv receivers don't have DiSEqC options then it wouldn't work either way.

Not even my 'normal' receivers can combine Unicable/JESS/dCSS with legacy DiSEqC commands.
What receiver(s) do you have, that can?

Greetz,
A33
 

ozumo

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Not even my 'normal' receivers can combine Unicable/JESS/dCSS with legacy DiSEqC commands.
What receiver(s) do you have, that can?
My GT Media V9 Prime allows me to set DiSEqC 1.0/1.1/1.2/USALS after selecting Unicable as LNB type. Haven't tested it.
 

a33

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Well, that makes clear that Haa-sat should check what his receivers are capable off, Unicable/Diseqc-wise.

In the meantime it looks like having an extra cable to the dishes is no problem. That is good.

Another question would be if the LNBs have identical user-band frequencies, or not. In the second case, all satellites must be defined double; and some sort of automatic switching would be impossible, I think.

Automatic switching to the little dish, when the motorized dish is being used, would be a challenge, but possible I think. But I don't know if he wants just one, or all his receivers to have access to all motorized satellite positions, or that he just wants to use the (automatic) little dish backup when the motor is used on a certain receiver?

When the automatic switching is chosen, it will have some boundaries to what is possible. Manual switching every time between the dishes gives more hassle, but more possibilities. I don't know what is important to him?

Greetz,
A33
 

Haa-sat

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Well, that makes clear that Haa-sat should check what his receivers are capable off, Unicable/Diseqc-wise.

In the meantime it looks like having an extra cable to the dishes is no problem. That is good.

Another question would be if the LNBs have identical user-band frequencies, or not. In the second case, all satellites must be defined double; and some sort of automatic switching would be impossible, I think.

Automatic switching to the little dish, when the motorized dish is being used, would be a challenge, but possible I think. But I don't know if he wants just one, or all his receivers to have access to all motorized satellite positions, or that he just wants to use the (automatic) little dish backup when the motor is used on a certain receiver?

When the automatic switching is chosen, it will have some boundaries to what is possible. Manual switching every time between the dishes gives more hassle, but more possibilities. I don't know what is important to him?

Greetz,
A33
I have checked and find out pay TV receivers not suport DISEQC, but supports DCSS. Yes all 24 userband on DCSS LNB are identical. And all receivers on DCSS cable use only one satellite position. The little dish on this satellite position will only use the little dish automatically backup when the motorized dish are moved to a other satellite position. If it's possible, I want work automatic and can accept manual if it's no possible.
 

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Not even my 'normal' receivers can combine Unicable/JESS/dCSS with legacy DiSEqC commands.
What receiver(s) do you have, that can?

Greetz,
A33
I have these receivers in the picture. It looks like receivers receives signal from DISEQC port 1 or only one LNB becauce maybe receivers don't support DISEQC.
 

Haa-sat

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Yes, to change dishes you'd need to change a setting or have a second set of channels saved to a separate position on the receiver. If the pay-tv receivers don't have DiSEqC options then it wouldn't work either way.

The best solution would be a larger dish.
I find out pay-TV recivers not support DISEQC and can have only one channel list on the receivers with only channels from TV subscription. I think will try with manual switch and maybe look on possibilities for bigger dish later if don't work good.
 
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