UK TV in Europe after 2e 2f and 2g are operational

[solly]

the questen if astra 2f will be use pan europe beam same transponder or only uk beam bicose it replace astra 1n ?
if it use pan europe beam we can get sky uk few transponder

 

[PaulR]

The consensus is that 2F will generally use the widebeam transponders for the encrypted $ly channels and the narrowbeam transponders for unencrypted Freesat channels.

 

[andrewcrawford]

OK this is extenedx uk beam using calculations with maths and the Spotbeams on the newer Birds and how they drop off etc. I am really crap at image maliutlation so it looks pretty bad but it gives a idea, i also cant move thie original ontoa bigger map so i cn extend it further if someone wants to take the information from wha ti have done and put it onto another map and make it look better be my guest i can check it to see if it follows my predicitions

 

[Lazarus]

Interesting work, Andrew!

 

[michalmichal]

Andrewcrawford - How do you expect signal strenght for German-Polish border and slightly east (about 200 km east) ? Can it be 40 dbW ?
EIRP Size
55dBW 40cm
54dBW 45cm
53dBW 50cm
52dBW 50cm
51dBW 55cm
50dBW 60cm
49dBW 65cm
48dBW 70cm
47dBW 75cm
46dBW 80cm
45dBW 90cm
44dBW 90cm
43dBW 100cm
42dBW 110cm
41dBW 120cm
40dBW 120cm
39dBW 135cm
38dBW 150cm
37dBW 180cm
36dBW 240cm
35dBW 300cm
34dBW 355cm
33dBW 400cm
32dBW 450cm


​

 

[andrewcrawford]

Andrewcrawford - How do you expect signal strenght for German-Polish border and slightly east (about 200 km east) ? Can it be 40 dbW ?
EIRP Size
55dBW 40cm
54dBW 45cm
53dBW 50cm
52dBW 50cm
51dBW 55cm
50dBW 60cm
49dBW 65cm
48dBW 70cm
47dBW 75cm
46dBW 80cm
45dBW 90cm
44dBW 90cm
43dBW 100cm
42dBW 110cm
41dBW 120cm
40dBW 120cm
39dBW 135cm
38dBW 150cm
37dBW 180cm
36dBW 240cm
35dBW 300cm
34dBW 355cm
33dBW 400cm
32dBW 450cm


​

ill need a map to give a better predicition but just now i will say about 30-35dbw
as the picture above only just covers gremany and it is 50dbmw and it starts dropping quite quickyly if i am right, im guessing the power east of germany will be very low

 

[Huevos]

How do you expect signal strenght for German-Polish border and slightly east (about 200 km east) ?

Probably about 38, just like the current satellite.

 

[solly]

it posible to to get more east footprint extended footprint of astra 2f uk beam like grecee and turkey ?

 

[Analoguesat]

it posible to to get more east footprint extended footprint of astra 2f uk beam like grecee and turkey ?

We will answer that this time next year ;)

 

[andrewcrawford]

Probably about 38, just like the current satellite.

if i am right it will be quite a steep drop down of power once it reaches germeny

 

[Huevos]

if i am right it will be quite a steep drop down of power once it reaches germeny

And if you are wrong it won't.

 

[joddle]

I think the sideways - ie east and west drop off - is bound to be a lot steeper than the south drop-off - simply due to the way the beam illuminates the world from its position which is generally south of the uk - good for those in France and Spain but not so good for those in the east such as Cyprus and Turkey. Germany is possibly in that "dont know" area and we won't know until the bird starts squarking.

 

[Satellite74]

I think the sideways - ie east and west drop off - is bound to be a lot steeper than the south drop-off - simply due to the way the beam illuminates the world from its position which is generally south of the uk

I think the opposite should actually be more true, given that the satellite will serve an area with a core illumination zone situated around 0-1°W from an orbital position of 28°E.

But yes, Germany will probably be a big "don't know". Berlin and the east will probably need dishes the size of an inflatable children's pool, while in the western part towards Cologne, 80 to 120 cm might well be enough.

Still just speculation...

 

[michalmichal]

There are dish sizes referring to dbW but how dish gain refers to these data? For example, 120-125cm dish can have 42.1 db gain at 12700 (laminas 130x120), about 43db at 12700 (emme esse 125cm- 42.5db at 12.000 I think 43db at 12700) 42.4db at 12700 (famaval 125) 43.4db at 12700 (Mabo 125 it is a bit bigger than the other ones, though ) 43.3db at 12700 (Gibertini 125). It differs from 42.1 to 43.4. What dish ( with what gain ) do they take into consideration when they were preparing the list (chart) below ? How does gain refer to these data below?

I'd buy emme esse 150 with 43.5db at 12000 which is about 44db at 12700 instead of laminas and Gibertini 150 which have 44.1 and 44.3 because it is smaller but the gain is similar. I'd buy a dish with higher gain instead of bigger one with similar gain but how it refers to these data below?


EIRP Size​

55dBW 40cm​

54dBW 45cm​

53dBW 50cm​

52dBW 50cm​

51dBW 55cm​

50dBW 60cm​

49dBW 65cm​

48dBW 70cm​

47dBW 75cm​

46dBW 80cm​

45dBW 90cm​

44dBW 90cm​

43dBW 100cm​

42dBW 110cm​

41dBW 120cm​

40dBW 120cm​

39dBW 135cm​

38dBW 150cm​

37dBW 180cm​

36dBW 240cm​

35dBW 300cm​

34dBW 355cm​

33dBW 400cm​

32dBW 450cm​

 

[L0nk]

Well, for Germany... I fear we'll soon need an update of that map if things come as expected.

_http://sat.beitinger.de/astra_2d_english.html

For the rest: We'll know in 6 to 9 months I'd say! Is there a launch date for Astra 2F?

 

[Huevos]

I'd buy emme esse 150 with 43.5db at 12000 which is about 44db at 12700 instead of laminas and Gibertini 150 which have 44.1 and 44.3 because it is smaller but the gain is similar.

Dish size is the only indicator of performance. Forget those gain figures on a PR pamphlet. Most important thing when comparing similar sized aerials is a solid dish on a solid mount that won't move when windy or distort when handled.

 

[Satellite74]

Well, for Germany... I fear we'll soon need an update of that map if things come as expected.

_http://sat.beitinger.de/astra_2d_english.html

For the rest: We'll know in 6 to 9 months I'd say! Is there a launch date for Astra 2F?

No... for now, all that's relatively certain is "Q4 '2012", as per SES's web site:

_http://www.ses.com/4233127/upcoming-launches



And then probably another two to three months to get the bird to its permanent orbital position, do some testing, and then switch over all the transponders. Probably very similar to 1N...

And depending on where in the Southwest of Germany you are located, I'd say your area can still expect decent reception with 2F... at least going by that map. Hanover, where I live, might be a bit of a different story... but I doubt they will manage to shut central Germany out completely. My balcony can accommodate anything up to 120cm, and I am pretty sure that that will be enough.

[warning]Live External Link Disabled[/warning]

 

[joddle]

No... for now, all that's relatively certain is "Q4 '2012", as per SES's web site:

_http://www.ses.com/4233127/upcoming-launches



And then probably another two to three months to get the bird to its permanent orbital position, do some testing, and then switch over all the transponders. Probably very similar to 1N...

And depending on where in the Southwest of Germany you are located, I'd say your area can still expect decent reception with 2F... at least going by that map. Hanover, where I live, might be a bit of a different story... but I doubt they will manage to shut central Germany out completely. My balcony can accommodate anything up to 120cm, and I am pretty sure that that will be enough.

[warning]Live External Link Disabled[/warning]

Hmm - I thought the 1N migration was going to be to 2E not 2F - and that would happen in late 2013 - so it begs the question, which bird is going to be used for the UK broadcasting?

 

[woborny]

Hmm - I thought the 1N migration was going to be to 2E not 2F - and that would happen in late 2013 - so it begs the question, which bird is going to be used for the UK broadcasting?

from the link given :

the new birds are not being launched in sequence...2f is before 2e

2f launches q4 2012
2e launches q2 2013
2g launches q1 2014

so maybe migration from 1n to 2f is late 2012 - early 2013...if thats the plan

 

[Huevos]

I thought the 1N migration was going to be to 2E not 2F

That's correct, but maybe 2F is going to give us some warning as to how the 2E UK PSB beam might end up looking.